Murray Pounded For Third Straight Loss At Indian Wells; Federer, Nadal Today
by Staff | March 11th, 2012
  • 164 Comments

Andy Murray’s Indian Wells title hopes quickly evaporated in his opening match last night in the desert. The world No. 4 suffered a shock loss to Spaniard Guillermo Garcia-Lopez who pounded the Scot 6-4, 6-2.

“I didn’t move my best tonight, but it didn’t feel like I was moving really badly,” said a stunned Murray afterward. “My return let me down, and he hardly missed the ball, either. That’s the thing. The level of tennis nowadays you get no easy first round matches and you play poor match, that’s what happens. So can’t allow it to happen. I don’t know exactly why because I was playing really, really good tennis the whole of the week and the buildup to it.”

Garcia-Lopez, who has beaten big names before like Rafael Nadal and Andre Agassi, called the victory one of his best.

“It’s one of the biggest wins in my career,”said the 92nd-ranked Garcia-Lopez. “It gives me a lot of confidence, as my ranking right now is not too good, so I wanted to improve it. This victory gives me some confidence that I can do better this season.”

The loss was Murray’s third straight at Indian Wells all in straight sets. And it’s his second straight since beating world No. 1 Novak Djokovic a week ago in Dubai as he lost to another one-handed player, Roger Federer, last Sunday.

“It almost felt like playing the match on a clay court,” added Murray who was 0-7 on break chances. “I wasn’t able to hit through the court and I squandered so many chances.”

“I was feeling way more focused and confident, so I’m not sure exactly why that happened tonight.”

Murray is still entered in doubles with brother Jamie. His exit opens the door for brash American Ryan Harrison. The 19-year-old Harrison hammered Viktor Troicki and will now meet Garcia-Lopez on Monday.

Slumping former No. 1 Andy Roddick scraped through a tough three setter against Lukasz Kubot. Kubot served for the match in the second set but was unable to finish Roddick off, and the American took advantage to win 4-6, 7-6, 6-3.

“In the first two sets I couldn’t have hit a return into the ocean from the beach, much less on a tennis court,” said Roddick. “I started swinging out of my returns a little more. That was all the difference.

“It was just a matter of making him pay for not making first serves, and I did not do that at all early in the match and then I did it well. It was like a line in the sand. It went from terrible to good for whatever reason.”

Roddick now meets Tomas Berdych in Monday’s showcase match. “You’re not gonna want to leave the ball hanging or let him get set,” said Roddick who leads the Czech 6-3 in their head-to-head. “You kinda have to mix some things up so he doesn’t get a rhythm. Once he starts kinda going and feeling good, he hits the ball so clean you kinda have to take him out of that a little bit.”

Novak Djokovic opened his title defense with a scratchy 6-3, 6-2 win over Kazakh qualifier Andrey Golubev.

In women’s play, former No. 1s Maria Sharapova, Ana Ivanovic and Caroline Wozniacki were all easy winners.

Today, Roger Federer opens against young American Denis Kudla. In his first match since his epic Australian Open final loss to Djokovic, Rafael Nadal meets tough Argentine Leonardo Mayer. Juan Martin Del Potro, David Ferrer and Milos Raonic are also in action. Del Potro, who’s 16-4 on the season, duels Delray Beach finalist Marinko Matosevic. Ferrer faces Grigor Dimitrov.

Petra Kvitova, Victoria Azarenka and Agnieszka Radwanska headline play for the women.

STADIUM 1 start 11:00 am
[Q] M Matosevic (AUS) vs [9] J Del Potro (ARG) – ATP
L Mayer (ARG) vs [2] R Nadal (ESP) – ATP

Not Before 2:30 PM
[1] V Azarenka (BLR) vs [25] S Kuznetsova (RUS) – WTA
[6] J Tsonga (FRA) vs M Llodra (FRA) – ATP

Not Before 7:00 PM
[WC] D Kudla (USA) vs [3] R Federer (SUI) – ATP

Not Before 8:30 PM
[27] F Pennetta (ITA) vs [5] A Radwanska (POL) – WTA

STADIUM 2 start 11:00 am
[18] A Kerber (GER) vs V King (USA) – WTA
[15] F Lopez (ESP) vs M Baghdatis (CYP) – ATP
[5] D Ferrer (ESP) vs G Dimitrov (BUL) – ATP

Not Before 4:30 PM
[3] P Kvitova (CZE) vs [32] C Mchale (USA) – WTA
[27] M Raonic (CAN) vs C Berlocq (ARG) – ATP
[WC] J Hampton (USA) vs J Gajdosova (AUS) – WTA


Also Check Out:
Backhands Hammered in Losses for Roddick, Federer at Indian Wells
Andy Murray: The Courts At Indian Wells Are Very Slow, They’re Also Very Slow Here In Miami
To Rest His Knees, Rafael Nadal Might Not Play Indian Wells
Poll: Djokovic, Federer, Murray Or Nadal, Who’ll Win Indian Wells?
Andy Murray Won’t Play Dubai In 2013, He’ll Focus On Indian Wells

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164 Comments for Murray Pounded For Third Straight Loss At Indian Wells; Federer, Nadal Today

jane Says:

G-Lo isn’t an easy first rounder plus he was zoning last night. Meanwhile Andy’s first serves weren’t going in and perhaps he was not able to take advantage of G-Lo’s 2nd serves. But it happens. Roddick almost went out. Nole’s opponent helped him by hitting a lot of errors. And so forth. There is no need to doubt Andy M’s quality just because of one “off” day. He’ll bounce back imo. He has been deep into almost all of the big events in the past year; that’s what really matters.


Fot Says:

Andy said “it seems like I was playing on clay out there”…. Guess that explains it because Murray hasn’t made a clay court final ever, has he?

I really wish there WAS a difference between the hard courts and the clay courts (other than sliding…but they now slide on hard too, don’t they)! lol! To me, they are making the hard courts toooooooo slow.

As far as this match, I watched it and Murray was totally “off” on his ground strokes. He was hitting in the net, hitting long, wide, everywhere but in! Lopez took advantaged and beat him, but Murray definitely helped beat himself with a million errors! lol!

Novak’s match was so-so because his opponent looked like Murray did in his match. He couldn’t string 3 hits together without making errors. You don’t win against Novak (or any of the top players) by making a million errors! lol!

I thought Roddick was going out but I see he pulled through. I look at Roddick and I wonder “where has the power gone”? His groundstrokes are just ‘so-so’ right now. He use to have a fantastic forehand, but now it looks like he just pushes the ball. He won because his opponent tried to come to the net on ‘bluffs’! lol!

I guess the good thing about his next match is his H2H against Berdych.

It will be interesting to see how Roger will play tonight if the court is really playing slow. I know Nadal will have no trouble since he’s right at home on ‘clay’. Novak’s side opened up really good with Murray going out so I expect him to be back in the final.


Ajet Says:

I also think murray’ll bounce back. people’re these days either getting super-excited on a win of their guy or super-upset over one loss. one loss is not the end of the world, nor is one victory at IW means the sureshot sign of world tennis dominance for the rest of the season!


Ajet Says:

that’s a matter of concern if murray really felt that court was playing like clay! :(


alison hodge Says:

dissapointed about murray,but yeah to put it in perspective,im sure he will bounce back soon enough,lack of matches and a bit rusty,is what i would put it down to,shame really as i saw him as the only one capable of testing novak,on that side of the draw,novak got through and im sure he will only get stronger,will he be tested though against anyone?i very much doubt it somehow,looks a shoo for the final,and the trophy imo,the only thing i wonder is who hes likely to face?


Nirmal Kumar Says:

jane says “There is no need to doubt Andy M’s quality just because of one “off” day.”

Nice to see some sanity in tennis fans, rather than getting emotional and thrashing Andy.

People got to understand that Top players were used to loss in 1st or 2nd round of slams, not just Masters. It’s not a big deal. Most likely having good success in Dubai has caused his downfall. Looks like he could not adapt to the slow courts quickly.


Roger Federer Fan Says:

Hope Federer continues his winning ways in IW too.


alison hodge Says:

sorry not lack of matches,as he played last week duh.


Dan Martin Says:

Murray losing makes Novak’s path a lot easier. My picks for today’s ATP matches – http://tennisabides.com/2012/03/11/indian-wells-picks-for-3-11-2012-2/


Miles Says:

“It almost felt like playing the match on a clay court,” added Murray who was 0-7 on break chances. “I wasn’t able to hit through the court and I squandered so many chances.”

Well, guess what – Garcia Lopez WAS able to hit through the court. It just takes a bit more hitting technique and power on your forehand. Not to mention that glorious versatile backhand.

Murray’s forehand has always been a liability when he cannot counterpunch, as he does on fast courts. On slower courts you need to produce your own pace consistently, and he simply does not know how to do that.

Lendl can try to teach him, but that’s something you learn from your junior days.


Wheeler Says:

No big deal, sometimes this happens, but it happens very very rarely for top 3 in Masters 1000 or Slam. This is what separates Murray from the top 3 IMHO.


Fot Says:

Murray said Lendl was trying to help him out on a ‘new’ forehand. Evidently – it’s not working yet.


Nina Says:

Maybe the Top 4 have spoiled us so much that we are shocked that they can lose in a first round or even any match before semifinals. The last slams and master tournaments have had all the Top 4 in the later stage of the tournament. So it’s shocking when someone like Murray, the weakest of the Top 4, loses his first round. But I don’t think it tell us anything. I find more worrying Federer’s demolition of Andy in Dubai than this. Because that final showed again that Murray is one or two steps behind the Top 3 when it comes to deliver at the very end. That’s what separates him from Novak, Roger and Rafa.


jane Says:

Tignor has a good article on Murray’s loss for anyone interested.

BTW, I don’t find Nole’s draw that easy that he won’t be tested. Golubev is not an easy first rounder – he is inconsistent, yes, but imo very talented. It’s just that for every 2 shots he hits winners in the court, he hits 4 UEs, lol. If he could get it together he might be tough. Anyhow, Nole has Anderson next – and he just won Delray beating Roddick and Isner along the way. He is a tough out in any event but especially on hard courts. He took Murray out last year in Canada. If Nole gets past him then it’s not too bad next round, but then he could face either Berdych or Roddick, then maybe Isner or Fish. These are all talented players who’ve been top ten (or close to in Isner’s case), so Nole can’t or shouldn’t underestimate anyone.

As Murray’s loss shows, we just never know. What’s on paper doesn’t always match with what’s on the court. “Just saying” as skeezerweezer would say. :)

At the moment, both Delpo and Davy are playing better in the second sets.


jane Says:

p.s. Hi Nina, long time no “see” you around here.


sheila Says:

well if iw plays like clay court as murray said then nadal will surely win this. the ball will probably bounce higher & federers backhand will be in a world of hurt most likely. i would love 2c federer get thru his tuff draw, but who knows.


steve-o Says:

I agree with Miles. When Murray can’t play the waiting game, he finds it hard to go on offense.

To his credit he is trying to change that. But you risk more mistakes being more aggressive.

Garcia-Lopez had a solid game plan and he was able to execute it and break down Murray’s backhand. Any of the top three would have buckled down

Watched the Del Potro match and the court is indeed v-e-r-y slllooowwwwwww. Matosevic was able to take advantage of his lack of speed for a bit, but Del Potro survived and is rolling now.


jane Says:

Rafa’s cruising! I surprised Leo Mayer got by Falla in their long 3 setter. He is sure not serving well today though – 30% first serves.


Humble Rafa Says:

Murray said Lendl was trying to help him out on a ‘new’ forehand. Evidently – it’s not working yet.

Master Choker aka Mr. Lady Forehand’s forehand currently belongs in the women’s game. Amazing that you could become No3 or No4 without a decent forehand. He hit better on the FH at the Aus Open and in Dubai. But habits are hard to overcome.

24 is too late to get a new forehand.


steve-o Says:

I was about to say: any of the top three would have buckled down and played a bit more aggressively, but not too much more so. Murray went between extremes last night: either he was in passive mode, retrieving, or he was going for way too much.


Brando Says:

For me andy lost because his backhand went AWOL. That is his main weapon, and that is not there along with his serve- andy’s liable to lose against anyone!


Brando Says:

^^lopez did play very well also- he did beat rafa in a SF once-so he is capable!


jane Says:

Tignor mentioned that Murray didn’t go for it on the forehand side as well. Here are his words:

“Murray said he had trouble getting the ball to penetrate through the court. It seemed like he overcompensated for that at certain points and was never able to find his range. More worrying was the way, down break points in the second set, he refused to pull the trigger when he got a mid-court forehand. Twice he settled for pushed drop shots instead. The one shot you can’t lose your confidence on today is the putaway forehand, but it’s never been a natural stroke for Murray.”

I missed some of the match, only started watching in the second set, but I also find with Andy that if his first serves aren’t going in, the rest of his game just doesn’t flow as well.


Wog boy Says:

HR, Andy is amost 25 (in May) !

I read few days ago Andy is saying how proud he is with his improved forhand and how it is becaming his major weapon.

What happened today, he left it in the hotel room?
I mean forhand.


Wog boy Says:

almost


Wog boy Says:

Jane, how rusty was Nole?
Was he serving OK?
Thanks in advance :)


jane Says:

Hi Wog Boy, I would say Nole was serving okay, yes. Not great but certainly good enough. His second serves were attackable though. He wasn’t firing on the return, his “talent”, as Vajda calls it, which worries me a little, as he has Anderson next, and we know how big he serves. As long as Nole can hold his own serves, though, he should be okay. Perhaps his groundstrokes weren’t as clean and penetrating as they can be as well, but, this was his first match (aside from doubles) so next round might tell us more about form. Nole knows what he needs to do, I think. Hopefully he can execute it going forward.


Brando Says:

Nice, good start for rafa after 6 weeks: 6-1,6-3 against Mayer!


alison hodge Says:

brando how did rafa play?


Brando Says:

@ Alison: pretty composed I thought. Nice rhythm on the serve, and constantly looking to take oppurtunities on the return. Nice start to the tourny, tougher challenges do await though.


marrisv Says:

Rafa was good after an extended break. His second serve return position needs improvement going forward as he gives up so much ground after his return


Skorocel Says:

Just read on the Swiss TV website that Federer apparently had an accident in a practice hitting with Gasquet. He allegedly fell on his wrist, but according to the site, he’ll play his 2nd round match vs Kudla…


Brando Says:

@marrisv: I agree. I think rafa needs to realise that he’s a brilliant returner and that he should go for more attacking returns as opposed to ones that kickstart a rally.


alison hodge Says:

brando thanks just needed to know,if the match was convincing as the scoreline sujests,a positive start anyway,did he have trouble holding serve?and who does he play next?sorry twenty questions.


alison hodge Says:

sugests not sujests.


Brando Says:

He wa comfortable on serve, I don’t think he faced a BP. I’m not to sure who he plays next. Either way, after andy’s match I was somewhat nervous that this could be a bit tricky- thankfully it wasn’t.


Fot Says:

“Skorocel Says:
Just read on the Swiss TV website that Federer apparently had an accident in a practice hitting with Gasquet. He allegedly fell on his wrist, but according to the site, he’ll play his 2nd round match vs Kudla…”

Here’s a link on the ‘fall:
http://www.tennisworlditalia.com/Federer-cade-in-allenamento–articolo8388.html


Kimberly Says:

Rafa returned great towards the latter part of his match with Berdych. He is always a consistent returner but he basically puts it back into play and neutralizes the point. In that match he was actually smoking the returns.


dari Says:

Ok, Murray went down, huh? Have the match on dvr will watch when I get a chance! Sounds like GGL just played perfect. Hope that Murray just moved quickly on from this!


jamie Says:

Poor Murray will have to wait until grass season to start winning titles. Clay season officially begins in IW.


Kimberly Says:

didn’t realize tennis channel had these matches and watched the lakers celtics instead of Nadal! Now watching Ferrer Dimitriv not much of a match but azarenka looked good


Kimberly Says:

davydenko winning consecutive matches and Verdasco winning a match? Whats going on?


steve-o Says:

Cilic warming up against Nalbandian. Hope he can win to start his comeback from injury.


marrisv Says:

@Kimberly agree with Rafa’s returning in the berdych match. He should try to do that all the time as he certainly can.

@alison – Rafa was great on serve. I heard the commentator day he may have lost only 4 points on serve through the match. Next opponent is Granollers i believe


steve-o Says:

Cilic fights off a set point to take it to a tiebreak.


Kimberly Says:

I think kvitova going to end the year number one


Kimberly Says:

well maybe not, great match from Christina to get the win!


Kimmi Says:

ah kimberly, with that kind of play she will not finish in top 10. to erratic


Kimmi Says:

hmm, commentator says they are glad federer is here coz there is a rumor going around that he could be sick with the virus going around. hmmm! gulp!!!


jane Says:

Kimmi, and Skorocel mentioned that Fed may’ve hurt himself in a fall during practice. Not good news. Hopefully he is okay to play on, but if not he should just take the time to rest. He has played a lot already this year.


Kimmi Says:

hmm, where did he hurt himself, do you know?

denis kudla is not an experienced player. so if there is a problem, he could be the best one to start with.


Kimmi Says:

raonic with a quick start too. both him and fed are 4-1 up.


jane Says:

True re: the opponent; I haven’t heard of him. But Fed seems to be getting along fine. Kimmi I think Skorocel said wrist?


Kimmi Says:

raonic was 5-1 up, the gap now has been reduced to 5-4


Kimmi Says:

kudla is playing well now, he is forcing fed to come up with good shots.


Kimmi Says:

apparently six players have pulled out due to sickness (stomach virus), and the clinic visits have been up 15%


Daniel Says:

Look how the ball stops and bouces after it touches the court! No wonder Fed seems to making huge swings to generate extra power for his balls to be more close to the baseline and flat. But you see as well he is having more time to adjust. Both are hitting very hard this match, which is faster than other matches played.


El Flaco Says:

Fed played pretty good, but he definitely had a look of sickness on his face. Also taking deep breaths when he wasn’t winded. His mouth was open most of the match when normally he breaths through his nose.


steve-o Says:

Federer has won, and in fine style too, taking only about an hour. He looks very sharp, aside from that one break Kudla managed.

Hopefully the wrist business is not too serious and he will be able to play on. If it becomes a problem, I’m sure he will pull out.


contemperory Says:

Steve-o, Fed has won comfortably indeed. Did you happen to follow the Raonic Match? He has fired around 17 aces and playes pretty well too.

With the courts being slow, Fed may not have an easy game against him. What are the chances of an upset?


Michael Says:

When watching the Murray Vs Lopez match, I was wondering who was the No.4 – Is it Lopez or Murray ? Lopez played such high quality error free Tennis that Murray could’nt cope up with. It is ironical that Murray got the better of Lopez very easily in straight sets in their earlier matches, but today he was just pounded by his opponent. What must be hurting Murray is not his loss to Lopez but the scoreline which suggests Murray just did not live upto his reputation. Just after Lendl took over as Murray’s Coach, everybody was hyping his contribution to Murray’s game, but seeing this match I think they would have been stuck to reality. Murray is not just upto the standard of the top Three. It is plain and simple. He is a very good player nodoubt about it. But he is definitely not a great player atleast until this moment. If Murray aspires to be a great player, he must first learn to be consistent in his game. Lopez played well, but Murray played horribly and made many unforced errors and that helped Lopez psyche to level up his game on a higher plane. All and all, it seems that Indian Wells court just doesn’t suit Murray. He has been to the finals here just once beaten by Nadal but other than that his performance in this tournament has been miserable to say the least.


Michael Says:

Novak looked very rusty against Golubev. If he wants to win this Tournament, he must mark up his level.


Nirmal Kumar Says:

After watching Raonic play, it’s going to be a very tough one for Roger. It would be a better option for Roger to move on to Miami after playing heavy loaded schedule already. He is not going to gain much here. Worst he can go is Semis. I can’t see Roger beat Nadal in this slow court.


steve-o Says:

@contemperory: I actually think the slow court will help Federer in returning Raonic’s serve. He will have more time to work the ball. Plus he can run Raonic around more.


contemporary Says:

Raonic was able to handle the conditions well, imo. Not sure if a Fed win can be taken for granted. I will not be surprised if we see a tight three setter, with an edge to Federer.

Plus, watching Delpo play, he is ever-improving. Who is he supposed to face in the 4th round? Davydenko/Bellucci – hopefully Fed should breathe more easily there. However, Fed needs to be at his best to reach the semifinal. Once he reaches the semifinal, he can look forward to Miami (Looks like the clay court season has already begun).


Dave Says:

Roger Federer admitted to having a fever after beating Denis Kudla in the second round. News reports said he “appeared pale and listless when he walked into the interview room, and there were reports he had suffered some stomach problems on court.” Federer claimed “It’s not a terrible temperature, but there’s something going on,” attributing the illness to contact with his family and not a result of the intestinal virus. “We are fighting something of our own in our family,” said Federer who is travelling with his wife and two young twin daughters. “I have a bit of a combination. Not a terrible temperature but I have some things going on. I am the best off in the family. The rest of them are struggling much more.”

Federer has a long history of downplaying or denying most of his ailments — perhaps because he is “old school” or because he doesn’t want to give his opponent hope — so we don’t really know how sick he is and whether his wrist is also injured, which I think he denied.

“There is currently a Coachella Valley-wide virus, which is resulting in symptoms of nausea and vomiting, fever and subsequent diarrhoea,” the local Eisenhower Medical Centre said. “It is self-limited and lasts between 24 and 48 hours. It is transmitted by air and direct contact and not passed via food.” Hospitals across the area had seen a surge of patients with such symptoms. “At Eisenhower Medical Centre, which provides medical support for the BNP Paribas Open, we have seen increases in overall visits to the emergency department by about 15 per cent over the past week, mostly adults and children with these symptoms,” the statement said. “We have seen fans and players at the tournament experience these symptoms as well.”

In an injury scare, three-time champion Roger Federer is due to take his place as expected later in the second round against American Denis Kudla, after the Swiss fell on his right arm and wrist Saturday during practice. Federer, winner of five of his last seven tournaments, took a tumble while hitting with Richard Gasquet.
http://www.digibet.info/topnewsgbtease/00_20120312075825_Del_Potro_ducks_virus_to_post_Indian_Wells_win.php

For an illness-prone rich athlete from Switzerland, Federer can be criticized for not taking better steps to protect himself especially during winter, e.g., mono in December-January 2008, pneumonia in February 2010, this illness in 2012. Switzerland is one of the most advanced European countries in natural and preventative medicines, but this competence is no use if a person is too stubborn to use it. Federer’s flu and/or stomach virus could probably have been nipped in the bud by using simple effective remedies such as high-quality oregano oil, olive leaf capsules, black elderberry extract and, for the stomach flu, Pepto-Bismol.


Roger de Vries Says:

^^^
The last paragraph, for real? I mean, for of all people forget it’s good to be ill now and then, if you regularly have a small fever or a cold but not much more it actually means you’re healthy. Plus, Federer is a top professional, of course he takes care of himself the best he can.
But we also know he’s in contact with so many people, and it’s in his gene to get a cold. It’s not for nothing he’s the best off in his family’s sickness.

I find people really hypocritical about illnesses, taking this and that, always wash your hand 24/7! Nah, then next time you’ll become ill much worse than this.


Roger de Vries Says:

Of course I forgot to add why, it’s good to come in contact with harmless germs. Just be considerate, don’t live a robot life scared of any possible germ around the corner.


Wog boy Says:

No bad feelings, but we are still waiting to hear how he is (Federer) doing number 1&2, how often, what is the firmness of number 2, is it floating or sinking, that could be a sign of a serious condition. Same for all the other affected players, or they are not worh mentioning in detail like #3 player in the world!

Ok, you can start the fire, I am ready for the first onslaught, I am in the trenches.


skeezerweezer Says:

Bummer Fed is sick:(. Ahhh…the family life with little ones……

Tennis is a self serving sport…..don’t know how Fed does it with a family and all….kudos to him.

Novak/Anderson , roddick/berdman….and Rafa in doubs against Dolgo, should be fun today.


El Flaco Says:

I think there is a reasonable chance Fed could lose to Raonic.


Tennis Vagabond Says:

Last day of snoozers today before the good stuff starts tomorrow. Get your chores done now!


Sienna Says:

If Roger is sick then he should really ask himself did I do wise to go for the exho last week. He shpuld leave those alone.They only consume youre energie that you need to stay healthy. It may have got nothing ot do with m bein sick at the moment. But just do not go for cashing those exho’s. However good your cause might be with the foundations and all. Winning a slam would mean much more for the foundation me thinks.

Well hope it is a 1 day affair and he’ll send that canadian tree already to Miami to losen the hips on a Salsa.


Brando Says:

Credit to roger for playing on- hopefully he’ll shake it off going forward.


sar Says:

On my way to see Nole…no sicknesses from him today please


jane Says:

Have fun sar: I hope he wins, and yeah no sicknesses. Both Monfils and Kohls have already withdrawn.


jamie Says:

My money is on Novak winning Indian Wells and then Miami.

He is the King of hard courts now.


alison hodge Says:

brando yeah i agree,but rogers roger and i doubt he would carry on playing if it was anthing too serious,virtually unheard of not in his nature,to retire either,hope hes ok,get well soon roger.


skeezerweezer Says:

sar,

Is this your first trip to IW? Was there last year was awesome! Don’t forget to check out the practice courts, they have a schedule too. The very best place to see the players close up hitting!!!!
This is where I got to see Nole work out on the court for an 1 1/2 up close, was awesome ;)

Hope you check out the great shopping tents…..


Kimmi Says:

jane – they also say melzer was sick, no wonder he lost so easily to bellucci.

http://ca.reuters.com/article/sportsNews/idCABRE82A0CK20120312


jane Says:

Kimmi, thanks, yeah we were wondering when Bellucci’s win came from because it seemed sort of out-of-the-blue. Well , that explains it!


Kimmi Says:

^^^ the report says melzer pulled out, that is wrong..melzer finished the match and lost 6-3 6-3

unless they meant doubles, was he playing doubles?


Kimmi Says:

i just checked doubles draw, melzer is pairing bagdatis in doubles. they are/were due to play isner/querrey in the first round.


Dave Says:

Roger de Vries: “The last paragraph, for real? I mean, for of all people forget it’s good to be ill now and then, if you regularly have a small fever or a cold but not much more it actually means you’re healthy…it’s good to come in contact with harmless germs” Is this paragraph for real? First, if you regularly get small fevers or colds, you are unhealthy because your immune system has failed to defend your body against the numerous viruses and bacteria your body routinely contracts everyday. Second, harmless germs are not the issue. However, if coming into contact with germs helps your body develop immunity to a variety of ailments, that’s good. But, despite being regularly exposed, if you regularly get colds and flus this indicates your immune system is not operating effectively (for whatever reasons). Third, it’s nonsense that Federer does not get much more than small fevers and colds. In January 2008 he suffered from mononucleosis. In February 2010 he had pneumonia. What else did Federer contract that he has not revealed?

Roger de Vries: “Federer is a top professional, of course he takes care of himself the best he can.” Despite being a top, rich professional who has taken steps to take care of his body, Federer has a long history of back injury as well as cold/flu infections, e.g. Miami 2004 when he struggled to beat young Davydenko in his first match, then lost to young Nadal in his next match (had heen healthy or withdrawn from Miami, history might turned out different). This indicates that what Federer has been doing is not good enough. He may be taking some steps but he may need to take more or other steps to prevent and treat his illnesses.

And Sienna is right: Federer’s MSG and other exhibitions may be unwise. It’s an additional stress and drain on energy. Instead of flying directly to Los Angeles, Federer stops in a different time zone and plays the exhibition while jet lagged and his body in the middle of its sleep cycle in Europe time.

On the other hand, Djokovic has an open mind and is willing to implement whatever it took to improve his body and mind t maximize his talent. Novak seems to have gone well beyond Federer’s traditional approaches, e.g., Djokovic’s CVAC oxygen pod to hiring an alternative medicine doctoron his team. Novak Djokovic’s greatest success started soon after he incorporated Igor Cetojevic (“I have a doctor in my team now that keeps up on all the things, for allergies and what I eat and things like that…He’s a great psychologist as well”). Cetojevic is skilled in far more than just allergies, diet and psychology, and could have have had an impact on Djokovic’s overall health, recovery, mental state and performance not just on his supposed gluten allergy and breathing problems. When Cetojevic’s treatments became a controversial issue, there were convenient news reports of a split between Djokovic and Cetojevic. But no one really knows whether or not Djokovic has really stopped seeing Cetojevic, or whether the treatments continue in private.

If you understand alternative medicine, it gives you more options to be healthy. A simple example: recently, my part-time housekeeper told me her 3 month old baby daughter had been getting regular lung infections that were worrisome enough to lead to many visits to her paediatrician and now a specialist doctor without any improvement. So I helped the mother to educate herself on a simple, natural, safe remedy for the baby so she could decide whether to use it: a single drop of Oreganol P73 oil (wild, concentrated oregano oil) rubbed on each of the soles of the baby’s feet once each day as soon as she gets sick (or twice if symptoms were worse), then put her socks on and let her sleep. For the past two months, mother reports that baby rarely gets sick (and if so not for long).

Roger de Vries: “I find people really hypocritical about illnesses, taking this and that, always wash your hand 24/7!” I find people really stupid about illness. Numerous studies have shown that regular handwashing with alcohol-based rubs and antibacterial soap is an effective first line of defense against getting sick. We are not talking about washing your hands every 5 minutes (that someone with mysophobia might do), but using common sense when to wash your hands, e.g., after you pump gass at a gas station, use an ATM machine, use a public washroom, come in contact with a germ bag named de Virus.
http://nurse-practitioners-and-physician-assistants.advanceweb.com/sharedresources/advancefornp/resources/downloadableresources/np030104_p76handout.pdf


Kimmi Says:

“Melzer, who had been beaten in the second round of the ATP tournament, pulled out of the men’s doubles on Sunday”

OK, he pulled out of double. I might have missed that. seppi was also sick, i remember him retiring against fish. zvonarena and mattek-sands were sick also.

I hope this virus has passed. hopping there is no more retirements/withdraws due to this.


andrea Says:

stosur getting pummelled by petrova. not a good start to 2012 for the USO champ.


Kimmi Says:

schiavoni just retired from her match against safarova


El Flaco Says:

“but using common sense when to wash your hands, e.g., after you pump gass at a gas station, use an ATM machine, use a public washroom, come in contact with a germ bag named de Virus.”

or after you sign a bunch of autographs


Fot Says:

People are getting on Roger for playing the Exho, but from what I’ve read…the SICKNESS did not start until he got to Indian Wells! He wasn’t sick when he played New York. All this illness ‘stuff’ happened at this tournament. His family getting sick, a lot of the other players getting sick, heck – they said even half of that area is sick so stop blaming Roger’s exho for him getting sick.


jane Says:

I agree with you overall Fot, and especially when adults are around small children: they are definitely more prone to getting sick. That said, lots of travelling can wear a person out, and Fed has played and travelled a lot this spring, from DC, to Rotterdamn, to Dubai, to NYC for the exo, and now to IW, so he may be a little bit more run down than he would be otherwise. That’s about all I could see out of it.


Sienna Says:

Of course ypu are right to state that the sickness came in this tourney and he has litle children so they carry a lot of illness for the parents. On the other hand he is a topatlete his body is tuned for perfection. With the low fat BMI they got they are walking a thing line. Like Dave said he took a risk and choose to put his body and mind in the red with that exho. If this catches him I hope he wont have to regrett the taking up the exho.

I ghave not forgotten how he was taking on the retired Sampras for a few nitwit matches in the states. The dominator got dominated that year.

He finally had cracked the Nadal puzzle more or less but the mono threw that out of the window.

That doesnot take anything away from the year 2008 which could easiley be in hineside his greatest achiement ever. For the sheer willpower and tenacity he showed in that year. Maybe he learned a lot from 2008 maybe there was where he learned that he was willing to go where nobody would dare to go.

But I thought he was through with exho or atleast try to fit them during the holidays like de Nadal matches last year.


marrisv Says:

Anderson has got a lethal return….


jane Says:

Beh, Nole not playing so well again today. Errors, 50% first serves, etc – it’s early goings in the match but still; he needs to find another gear. His groundstrokes are solid and deep when he’s connecting though. That part looks great.


jane Says:

Nole is still at only 50% first serves and yet he wins the set 6-2. He is able to pressure Anderson’s serve, although Kevin is not serving to his full capacity either, at only 54% firsts at the end of the set. Now Anderson is missing more than he was at the start of the set. We’ll see what happens in set two. Nole is down love-30 on his service game right now.


skeezerweezer Says:

@jane,

Nole better get that his serve going or he could run into trouble later on. :( That said,he should get through here….


Brando Says:

Nole is winning- as expected. Only Isner MAY test him based on todays play.

Isner has been playing well so far this year- and can cause trouble to the top players (Rafa F0 2011).

Berdych, based on his 1st round, shouldn’t cause trouble.


jane Says:

skewer agree. But his serve has been much better in the second set – 5 aces is reasonable methinks.

Brando, Anderson is no slouch when he’s on, but (a) his first serve isn’t clicking, and (b) this is Anderson’s first singles match as Khols’ sickness gave Kevin a walkover, so he had no first match to get used to the conditions and establish a rhythm. Finally, tactically he hasn’t played well, i.e., trying to slug it out from the baseline versus Nole – not smart. I thought it would be closer. But that said, I am happy it wasn’t. :)


jane Says:

skeezer, you are skewer – my spellcheck changed your name. :)


skeezerweezer Says:

No prob jane hehe..re; nole serve…the sun is bright over the so who knows ..Could have been a factor ..it did get better in the second…


Brando Says:

@jane: I agree re Anderson. Nole is on a different level ATM – his play post AO is a bit hit and miss though- so only a handful of players can stand a genuine chance against him. Anderson, as competent as he is, was never really going to- and based on his play/ tactics today, what little chance he may had- he screwed it up himself! Isner is the only one on nole’s side who MIGHT test him, other than him nole should have it smooth sailing.


jane Says:

I hope you’re right Brando. I will watch Berdych and Roddick to see where their forms are at too. Right now I am surprised to see Fish lost the first set to Ebden.


Brando Says:

Re roddick/ berdych: they both struggled in round one, so it could be a close one between those 2.


Wog boy Says:

Sar, stay where you are. Don’t move until IW is finished. You might be Nole’s, lady luck when he needs it:-)

What is your opinion about Nole? How did he look like, relaxed, fresh? It is different when you are there than on TV.

Jane, thanks for yesterday post about Nole’s game and todays, same for Brando, skeezer. Anderson was never easy, imo. Good he did it in two, now he can play football with his tim and Tipsy and Troicki (Troicki has got plenty of time now):)

I don’t know why, but I am having a problem accessing scores on ATP site same with my ATP app. It keeps failing, I am lucky if it goes through one out of ten times. It must be
my phone. It is frustrating when you cannot see result, but thanks God there is always somebody posting here.


Fot Says:

Novak is doing what he is suppose to do. Win. I don’t see anyone left on his half of the draw that will give him any problems. He should have a good run right to the finals again. (unless the sick bug hits him too) lol! Hopefully it won’t, Jane.


Kimmi Says:

what!! fish is out.


Fot Says:

Did you guys see the poll they were asking about how many Americans we think will be in the 10 ten at the end of the year? I don’t think Fish will be.


Nina Says:

@Jane… I’ve been awol for three months as Ive been travelling the world and couldn’t connect to internet as often as I wanted. I was however in Melbourne to watch AO live, saw Nole-Hewitt and Federer-Nadal on court. :)

I didn’t see Nole’s match today but people says he played on second or third gear. I find it scary that he can still win 6-2 6-3 playing like that. And Anderson is no joke. I don’t think he will be tested until the final, though. Murray’s upset was a real surprise and may I say disappointment.


jane Says:

Fish lost to Ebden? Who is Ebden? I think he’s an Aussie and that’s all I know.

Wog Boy, try googling “live tennis scores” next time ATP fails on you. There are other sites that provide more effective mobile updates imo. :)

Nina, i agree. I was kind of amazed Nole was able to come through today’s match fairly smoothly and on low gear. And yeah, disappointing about Muzza. Lucky you, traveling the world!! :)


jane Says:

Top ten Fot? Yeah, I doubt Fish will be there. I think Roddick said his goal is to get there again whereas Querrey says top 20 is his goal. Not sure what to expect out of Harrison just yet; to make real noise he has to break through at a Masters or ideally a slam. But Isner seems perhaps the most likely to reach top ten?


Steve 27 Says:

Murray = Great Choker
Gift 16 slam to Federer.


El Flaco Says:

Fish is not dealing well with the pressure of being a top 10 player.


Kimmi Says:

roddick broken right off the bat..

he has a 6-3 H2H but that happened when roddick was in the top 10


Wog boy Says:

Jane thanks, that one works. It was not my mobile:)

Ebden is a late achiver, I saw him at AO. he is good but I didn’t think so good to beat Fish. Ebden was more concentrated on his studies but he took tennis more seriosly in last 12-18 months. He is originaly from South Africa.


jane Says:

Kimmi and already in a dispute with the umpire, but I missed what happened as only watching with one eye.


Jose Says:

Do these seats ever get filled up in this stage of the competition or people are just not keen on watching Berdych?


jane Says:

Eeesh, Roddick double faulted on break point. It’s just not clicking tonight. Plus, i think if Roddick wants to get back to the top ten, he absolutely has to improve his return game; he’s done no damage on Berdych’s second serves, and Berdych has actually offered up more seconds than Andy has. Stefanki should be pushing Roddick to work on the return.


contemperory Says:

@Sienna:

“He finally had cracked the Nadal puzzle more or less but the mono threw that out of the window.”

What does the mono have to do with cracking the Nadal puzzle? Can you elaborate what you really meant ? Is it that if not for mono, Fed would have defeated Nadal quite often?


skeezerweezer Says:

Steve 27

:re : 8:02 post

Sorry that was just plain idiotic. C’mon man.


jane Says:

Roddick’s hitting some moon-like-balls and they kinda work versus Berdych – they’ve drawn a couple of errors.


jane Says:

Lots more errors from Berdych too.


El Flaco Says:

Roddick looks like he is hitting his forehand with a badminton racquet.


jane Says:

But the slice has worked for Roddick this set, and some spinny moonballs. It’s looking like he’ll push it to a third. Roddick has a good H2H with Berdych, which may work in his favour down the stretch.


skeezerweezer Says:

Gotta say am totally impressed with Roddick taking a set off the Birdman. Roddick can still compete and proving it, win or lose. Good for him. Never cared for Birdsh!t anyway after that Nic incident :(


Kimmi Says:

berdych looking good now. 4-1 up but only one break. roddick needs to stay with him. you never know.


Kimmi Says:

finish the match in a style, broke roddick to love.


jane Says:

Yeah, Berdych played well first and third sets – kept his composure. He lost the plot a little when Roddick started to play with the pace, but it didn’t continue to work because Tomas adjusted accordingly. I guess there is still Harrison and Isner for Americans.


steve-o Says:

Good match for Roddick, given that he’s still trying to come back from injury. A top ten player like Berdych was a very tough ask.

Hopefully Roddick can keep fighting and return to the top 20 soon.


sar Says:

Skeezer this is our second time here. The last one was when Ljubicic and Jankovic won. Great place. We got to the practice courts today and saw Rafa and Kaia Kanepi. Didn’t spend too much time but it’s nice to see them up close. Saw the Stosur match, Nole, and some Ivanovic. It was hot and we walked for miles. Maybe that is why Nole was sluggish-the hottest time of the day.

Wog boy, we will stay to see Nole one more time on Wednesday, we are going broke. Nole looked OK to me and I didn’t notice any problems with his serve but watching live is way different than watching tv. We were in the nose bleed section. When I see him live I am way more relaxed than watching on tv. I think it may have to do with idiot talking heads critcizing everything and making me nervous. Tomorrow we are going to Palm Springs/Desert to explore.


Wog boy Says:

Sar, thanks.

“Going broke”…that sounds familiar, after going to Europe last and Melbourne this year…..but who cares, we had a great time:)

If it is to hot and sunny don’t forget to SLIP, SLOP and SLAP!

Have a great time.


jane Says:

Have fun sar! How awesome to hear that you are relaxed; maybe I should try the mute button. :) But I like to hear the ball, etc. Sigh.


Nicole Says:

I think going with Ivan Lendl as his coach is going to backfire on Murray. Never understood that decision in the 1st place. How can Lendl help Murray get better except for the mental aspect of the game? Lendl has enough $$$ in the bank, only played golf for the past 10 years, and has no track record as a coach.

Why would anyone pick a coach who is uneducated as a coach, has no work experience as a coach, and no motivation to do well?

Here is an intersting article on finding/evaluating a tennis coach: http://fit-to-hit.org/2011/11/finding-your-tennis-coach/

cheers!


Sienna Says:

contemperory Says:
@Sienna:

“He finally had cracked the Nadal puzzle more or less but the mono threw that out of the window.”

What does the mono have to do with cracking the Nadal puzzle? Can you elaborate what you really meant ? Is it that if not for mono, Fed would have defeated Nadal quite often?

March 12th, 2012 at 8:59 pm

I trealy believe that that is the case. 2007 he already had a winning h2h for the year. Meeting Nadal so many times in 2008 and losing 5 matches was a real deathblow to any momentum Fed had in hteir matchup. I believe a fit and 100% matchthough Fed would won 2 or 3 of those matches.
They didnot meet many times the year after but until last year it was pretty much even stevens. (2009 and 2010)

2011 I consider not Feds strongest year on tour because he was not at primkeshape at the start of the year. So there were some far to easy losses against Rafa in the early part of that year. Not until Garros he got really 100 % and matchtough as I like to say.

It does not say that Fed would have steamrolled Nadal but the h2h is a litle tilted because of the monoyear. I think clay is of lesser importance. He could see him beat Nadal at Madrid.


Sienna Says:

Ofcourse including au open 09 final in those 5 matches.I truly believe is it?


Skorocel Says:

@Sienna: No one asked Roger to continue playing in 2008 if he really had that mono thing…

“Not until Garros he got really 100 % and matchtough as I like to say.”

And yet he lost to…


Sienna Says:

Skorocel
Yes in 2011 he lost a close 4 setter. But you agree that thepummeling of 2008 had more to do with Feds overall fyical condition then anything else.
And since you agree you must agree with me that he would not have lost wimbly 2008 if it wasnt for the mono.

In the end it doesnt really matter that much. Nadalfans always claim the Rafa lossescome with an injury. I’m not trying something like that. Just expressing the regrett for the mono and the double standard it has set for the h2h.

Btw I also think Fed is the man en the player today because of the figting monoyear. He showed what he was made off in that. SO you cannot have it both ways.


Dave Says:

Sienna: Yes, your big-picture perspective makes the most sense when you analyzed “(Federer) finally had cracked the Nadal puzzle more or less but the mono threw that out of the window…Meeting Nadal so many times in 2008 and losing 5 matches was a real deathblow to any momentum Fed had in hteir matchup. I believe a fit and 100% matchthough Fed would won 2 or 3 of those matches.”

Federer went from a 5-2 winning record with Nadal from July 2006 to November 2007 to a 0-5 losing record with Nadal from April 2008 to January 2009. The watershed was Federer’s mononucleosis illness in January 2008. It’s likely that Federer not only would have won zome of his matches against Nadal in that 2008-2009 losing stretch (e.g., Hamburg, Wimbledon, AO), Federer would have likely remained World No. 1 for 2008.

Before 2006, Federer and Nadal played rarely — so Federer had few opportunities to adapt to a new, younger player whose game was refined to beat Federer. Like Agassi, Federer also probably expected the playing career of Nadal to be disrupted by injuries, just like it happened to Hewitt, Muster, Kuerten, Courier, Ferrero, Coria, etc.

In 2006, Federer had the misfortune of having his best clay year (he would have preferred peaking on clay in 2004 or even 2005) and he suffered four early losses against Nadal in the 3 months between Dubai and French Open. Unlike Nadal (who crumbled to Djokovic after suffering four early losses to Djokovic in Spring 2011), Federer turned the tables on Nadal at the 2006 Wimbledon and again at 2006 WTF.

In 2007, Federer had a winning 3-2 record against Nadal on all surfaces: clay (Hamburg), grass (Wimbledon) and hardcourt (World Tour Finals). But the truth was that Federer was 5-2 against Nadal between July 2006 to November 2007 (actually till March 2008, since they didn’t play until 2008 MOnte Carlo). At 2007 WTF, Federer laid a pounding on Nadal that lasted only 59 minutes — it remains Nadal’s third worst defeat to today’s Big Four Players (second is 2009 Paris to Djokovic, worst is 2011 WTF to Federer).

Yes, Federer had finally cracked the Nadal puzzle. Federer’s 2007 season was better than Djokovic’s 2011 (Roger was in all four slam finals, won three slams and World Tour Finals, and had a 41-match winning streak, etc.) so Roger was poised to have an excellent 2008 that built upon his 2007 year.

[Footnote: In December 2007, after the WTF (TMC), Federer put his health at risk when he played three exhibition matches against Sampras in three different Asian cities... where for money, for tennis history or to increase public interest in tennis. Did Federer put unnecessary stress on his body or pick up the mono bug in Asia?]

But all that momentum was thrown out of the window as Federer was hit by debilitating mononucleosis in December/January 2008 and later with recurring back injury. Federer’s losses shot up from an average of 6 per year between 2004 to 2007 to 15 in 2008! Four of those 2008 losses were to Nadal, three on clay. In January 2009 Australian Open, Federer lost again to Nadal, possibly partly due to his recurring back injury (which flared up in 2008 as Federer tried to compensate with his loss in form and energy by relying on his serve to win more points).
http://www.menstennisforums.com/showthread.php?t=193260

Since 2009 AO Final,

- Federer and Nadal have met in four finals. Federer won two finals (2010 WTF, 2009 Madrid) and Nadal won two finals (2010 Madrid, 2011 French Open).

- Federer past his prime has a 3-5 losing record to Nadal in his absolute prime. Three of Nadal’s wins were on clay.

- Federer won three slams (2 points away from winning fourth at 2009 US Open) and two world tour finals. Nadal won four slams.

Skorocel: “And yet he lost to…” Had Nadal had the disadvantage of facing either Djokovic or Federer in the semifinal he either would have lost in the semifinal or been vulnerable to a loss in the final. Despite having the much easier semifinal against Murray, Nadal gave a setpoint to the first set and 15 breakpoints to a weakened Federer who was not able to capitalize fully. Federer still broke Nadal four games to Nadal’s six breaks.

Skorocel, you cannot keep trying to have it both ways.


jane Says:

I think if we use illness to explain losses (in part) then it’s fair to use injuries (e.g., Fed’s mono IN 2008 or Nadal’s stomach tear at USO 2009). I don’t necessarily see them as “excuses” myself, because injuries and illnesses are *realities* and part of being human! Thus, imo, they are and can be “partial explanations” for a loss/win but not the full explanation because it always takes two to tango. The other player has to keep up his share of the bargain and fight for the win (sometimes when an opponent faces an injured/ill player, he doesn’t know how to react or reacts with sympathy, which is humane and sweet and all that, but not the way to win a match! :)). I remember when Nole retired at the AO, Fed said something to the effect of “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play.” So I would imagine he holds himself to those same standards.

I guess it’s all or nothing: either “no excuses” for a loss, or a fair share of explanations, including both illness and injury and lack of light, and wind, and whatever else may’ve contributed – e.g. the opponent!! :D


Skorocel Says:

“if you’re not well enough, then don’t play.”

Exactly, jane. Now let’s tell that to those 2 above you…


Skeezerweezer Says:

^totally agree Jane. Records don’t care IF you were sick, hurt, etc..they just care about what you did, not what you didn’t, and the excuses you gave because of it.

It is true it is just the reality of the game. Welcome to Tennis, the sport.

My mantra , if your sick and/or hurt and you don’t think you can win, don’t play and then give an excuse when you don’t win. I mean why play?
Shut up and play, or withdraw. Or play to win, no excuses. And what aboutthe other guy?It also takes down the other guys great win and minimizes it.


Dave Says:

Jane, are you saying “Nadal’s stomach tear at USO 2009″ was the reason he was crushed 2-6, 2-6, 2-6 by Delpo in the 2009 USO semifinals? Nadal would have probably lost to Delpo even if healthy — Delpo’s level was very high. As ESPN’s Greg Garber noted: “(Nadal) was suffering from an abdominal muscle tear that affected all parts of his game, particularly the serve. But the way del Potro was playing — his forehand was so unhittable, like a pea coming from a slingshot, that it was hard to see — Nadal might not have had a chance even if he was completely healthy. The word del Potro used to describe his game was “unbelievable.” It was powerfully reminiscent of the surprising ascendance of another 20-year-old here, Russian Marat Safin, who torched then-four-time champion Pete Sampras in the 2000 final. For the record, Sampras won 10 games. Think this was a surprise? The Argentine has beaten Nadal three straight times since March and taken six straight sets.”

Facts:
- Delpo won because he felt was clearly the better player against Nadal on hardcourt. del Potro said “today I play unbelievable, and that’s was the key” and “I was so focused with my serve, with every breakpoints” Federer also saluted Delpo’s victory: “[Del Potro] played wonderful today against Rafa… He’s proved he’s a Grand Slam contender.”
- Delpo had already beaten Nadal in their last two matches just weeks before in 2009 Canada and in 2009 Miami. (Federer had a 5-2 winning record against Nadal in the 18 months before mono, but a 0-5 losing record in the10 months after August. Seems fishy, no?)
- Nadal won five matches in straight sets from 2009 Canada and Cincinnati, losing just to Delpo and Djokovic. Nadal won five matches (3 in straight sets) at USO before meeting Delpo. Thus over a four week period, Nadal won 10 matches mostly in straight sets out of 13 played during the four week period he had the muscle tear. Yet the tear was unbearable when he loses to Delpo? (an immune system illness like mono is less predictable — some days you feel good, other days you can’t get out of your bed)
- Nadal claimed medical tests had show he was injured early in Canada. If Nadal was severely injured he could have withdrawn or retired at any point in Canada or Cincinnati. (On the other hand Federer with mono played through the 2008 Australian Open because neither Roger nor his doctors knew it was mono at the time.)
- Nadal played Beijing just a few weeks after the US Open ended indicating the “muscle tear” was not severe if he could heal and return to practice so soon. (On the other hand, mono is an ailment more like a persistent flu with an unpredictable healing and recuperation phase… than an injury like a muscle tear that has a predictable healing and recuperation phase)

Yet Nadal devalued Delpo’s victory by making a big soap opera about his “abdominal muscle tear” before and after losing to Delpo… just as he did after losing in Montreal and Cincinnati a few weeks earlier. As usual Nadal starts of by seemingly praising his opponent for being the better player. Then soon Nadal reframes it as the loss was explainable because he was injured, wasn’t 100%, couldn’t play his best tennis.

- Q. To what degree did your stomach injury affect you today and in this tournament? RAFAEL NADAL: I going to repeat: He played much better than me, and for that reason he beat me. Later, it sounds like an excuse, no? Second thing, well, this year not very lucky year for me. A lot of bad things happen. First injury on the knees, tough injury. And when I came back, I came back perfect the knees, but maybe because I was few time outside of this competition and I must started played two Masters Series at the top level maybe was a little bit too much to come back, no? Is much better if you can start a little bit slowly with a little bit small tournaments not with the Masters Series. But I don’t have any option, because the calendar says that, and I did. I am very happy how I came back, but, now I had the first problem of the abdominal in Montreal after the match of Petzschner second round. I must gonna explain because I say during the week I prefer to didn’t speak about the injury during the week because I am in tournament right now. I can say after Montreal I was doing a test. I did a test in Montreal, and the doctor didn’t see a lot, but the pain is still there. Cincinnati, the pain increase a little bit more. After the semifinals against Djokovic, I went to do an MRI, and I had some edema, strained muscle, and I think during these two weeks the strain is converted into a little bit of rupture, no? A little bit break. Yeah, was tough to play few matches like this.

- Q. He’s beaten you three straight times now. What’s changed or what makes his game so difficult for you, especially recently? RAFAEL NADAL: I don’t know. He’s playing really well. That’s the true, no? You know, doesn’t matter that, no? Because I feel I played three times against him, and not one I played my tennis, no? So that’s the true, no? Because of him maybe, but in this case I think is more because of me… But I really didn’t play my best tennis in that three matches, no? Miami, if you remember, I was two breaks up in the first set, and — yeah, was a disaster. (laughter.). In Montreal was the first tournament after coming back on injury. And here is the more real one, but, you know, is more difficult.
http://www.asapsports.com/show_interview.php?id=59163

jane:”I remember when Nole retired at the AO, Fed said something to the effect of “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play.” What exactly did Federer say or was it your recollection? Could you give us the interview transcript?


Skorocel Says:

@Dave: You cannot be that stupid to think Federer was “at a disadvantage” in that final vs Nadal (after having to play against Djoker 2 days before), can you? ON THE CONTRARY, a true champion like Federer would be nothing else but SUPER MOTIVATED and with a SKY HIGH CONFIDENCE after defeating the best player of the world, who prior to their RG semifinal amassed 43 consecutive victories, and who, no less, beat this same Federer in 3 last meetings which they played before this semifinal in Paris… Yet Federer once again crumbled before the occassion, giving away the 1st set and thus the match to a very ordinary Nadal, who really couldn’t be more generous on that day (giving Federer breaks courtesy of a super-easy FH UE hit down the middle of the net, among other things)…

For god’s sake Dave, Federer didn’t lose a SINGLE SET before meeting the Djoker! He was rested and physically fit, and without any injury worries prior, during, and after the match. Nadal’s semifinal vs Murray lasted only 22 minutess less than the Fedovic semifinal, and Nadal actually had to stay more minutes on the court en route to the final, as he survived a tough 5-setter vs Isner in the 1st round (even though this is really not worth of mentioning, as it didn’t play any role in the final after all)… Then who was at a disadvantage really?


Dave Says:

Skorocel: You cannot be serious. You’ve just taken stupidity to new depths of dullness. Prior to the 2011 season, Murray had won a grand total of only 26 clay matches in his career — only 9 matches were at the French Open ( Nadal has won almost 10 times as many clay matches). You are essentially saying that Nadal’s practice match called the French Open semifinal against the clay-inexperienced Murray — where Rafa won a comfortable 55% of points — compared in any way to the gruelling gladiatorial battle between Federer and Djokovic. The greatest player of all time versus the greatest player of the moment at his peak having won 43 matches in a row. Many tennis commentators considered the Federer-Djokovic match the best match of the year. E.g., Tennis Magazine’s Steve Tignor’s Top 10 Matches of 2011 (men and women) was No. 1: Federer d. Djokovic, French Open semifinal and No. 2: Djokovic d. Federer, U.S. Open semifinal.
http://blogs.tennis.com/thewrap/2011/12/giving-them-the-index-finger.html

Your claim is utter nonsense that Federer “was rested and physically fit, and without any injury worries prior, during, and after the match.” First, Federer may have been sky high on confidence, but at 30 years and not at the physical level he should have been, he was vulnerable in the final to a grinder like Nadal. Second, even more significant, Federer was nursing a groin injury during the French Open final. Soon after the FO final Federer pulled out of the Gerry Weber Open in Germany with a groin injury. “I am very disappointed as it’s one of my absolute favourite tournaments on the ATP Tour, but my body, especially my groin, really needs a rest,” Federer said in a statement on his website. “After talking with my team this morning, I feel that it’s way too risky to take a chance on aggravating it even more before Wimbledon.” Google “Groin injury forces Federer out of Halle”. Not wanting to take away anything from Nadal’s victory, Federer did notg mention his injury at the post match press conference. Federer did not practice for a week after the French Open to heal his groin injury.

For god’s sake Skorocel, learn the facts before opening your mouth.


Skorocel Says:

Sienna: Sorry to disappoint you, but I’m not that stupid to think Federer’s losses to Nadal in 2008 (especially the ones at Wimby & RG) had to do anything with mono ;-) Firstly, if Federer himself says that “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play”, then I assume he was well enough to play these matches vs Nadal, wasn’t he? Secondly, after seeing Federer losing 2/3 of their 27 matches & more often than not crumbling mentally to his Spanish rival (who time and time again showed us that he’s simply the better player when it comes to really put a stamp on the match), only an idiot would think something else attributed to it…

As far as I know, Federer (contrary to people like you or Dave) never mentioned any illness or whatever as being even partially responsible for these defeats. Fact is, in Wimby 2008, he didn’t lose a single set en route to the final & overall was playing on a very good level throughout the whole tournament. Yet in the final, he was pretty much playing catch up from the start, having to face almost a constant attack from an otherwise defensively-minded opponent (who was simply outplaying him in most of the rallies)…

Re: Nadal’s injury excuses (or better said his fans’ excuses), well, that doesn’t bother me at all… No matter how good or bad he (or any other player for that matter) may feel prior to the match, if he decides to play and loses – his fault. “If you’re not well enough, then don’t play”, isn’t it?


Skorocel Says:

“First, Federer may have been sky high on confidence, but at 30 years and not at the physical level he should have been, he was vulnerable in the final to a grinder like Nadal.”

Of course he was vulnerable… But don’t forget that in 2 or 3 years, he, according to you, will be physically better than Nadal! ;-)


Steve 27 Says:

Dave.For god’s sake Skorocel, learn the facts before opening your mouth.

Fundamentalist, Dave. Again


jane Says:

Dave,

I said “partial explanation”. I didn’t say, necessarily, that Nadal would’ve won had he not been injured but *perhaps* the injury was a factor in the loss.

My point was simply this: if in a person’s viewpoint is that he or she allows illness as a reason/explanation/excuse for a loss, then, in my opinion, that same person should have to be fair and consider injury in the same: otherwise it’s double standards. There are other potentialRafa examples, for instance, Nadal’s loss to Soda at the USO or to Ferrer at the USO & AO. Each time there was, arguably, an injury involved. It seems like a double standard to say Fed lost because of mono but Nadal didn’t lose because of injury. It would seem more fair to say that in BOTH cases, injury or illness may’ve been a factor (only one – because there are MANY elements to a match) in the loss.

Personally I tend to accept valid explanations for losses (e.g. health or condition issues) but at the same time, I don’t want to take away the win from the opponent.

That’s in part why others say “forget it” – like skeeze and Skorocel. It’s either you win or you lose, no excuses.

My take is that the same standard should be applied for all players whether you take the first position or the second. That’s all.

Re: Fed’s quote, it’s based on recollection purely and admittedly; you’re welcome to google it if you’d like. It was something to that effect but not verbatim, as already mentioned: something like if you’re not fit don’t play.


Steve 27 Says:

Dave is Nadal’s hater, jane. He excuses Federer losses but attack the spaniard claims. Ironic,no?


skeezerweezer Says:

Steve 27 is Fed’s hater, jane. He excuses Rafa’s losses but attack the Feds claims. Ironic,no?


Steve 27 Says:

skeezerweezer your parody is so lame!


jane Says:

Ha ha, you two are making me laugh out loud, but I am not quite rolling on the floor. ;)


Dave Says:

jane: “My take is that the same standard should be applied for all players whether you take the first position or the second. That’s all.” In principle, yes, we should apply the same standard to all players, whether you deny or accept the use of excuses. However, there is a big difference where Federer and Nadal are concerned: Nadal seems to cry wolf and sensationalize his injuries/illnesses while Federer usually downplays his injuries/illnesses.

That’s why players and most observers tend to believe Roger when he said: “I promise you I had a lot of pain throughout my career, and I’ve managed to play with it.”

Players respect Federer for his old school attitude to injury, pain and retirements. “There are definitely players that are retiring so that the opponent doesn’t get the satisfaction of really beating them,” said John Lloyd, British Davis cup captain and former Australian Open finalist…. Players with the best records for not retiring when losing include those who are generally well-regarded for their competitive fairness and sportsmanship. Among the men, Roger Federer and James Blake have never quit while behind in a match (Federer has never quit/retired from any match in his ATP career, though he has two withdrawals due to injury before the match began… coincidentally to Blake and Tsonga, players he likes and respects). “I’m not surprised that Federer and Blake have never retired,” said Lloyd. “It’s kind of an old school mentality – you don’t ‘deef’ [default]. I think it’s the champion’s mentality. You’ve got to be a champion enough to know that you take it like a man and give the player the satisfaction that they beat you, whether you were injured or not.”… according to Lloyd. “The bottom line is that the really good champions don’t feel they’re going to lose until the last point, so they never throw in the towel. I don’t ever remember Chris [Evert, to whom he was married] defaulting…. “It’s pretty pitiful to (retire while losing) that unless it’s an obvious physical thing,” said Lloyd. “Once you play, you should play until the end – unless you can’t stand up, of course. These matches where players are retiring a game or two from defeat, that’s pathetic.”

read my next post regarding your incorrect quote “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play.”


Dave Says:

Skorocel: Did Federer really say ‘if Federer himself says that “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play” then I assume he was well enough to play these matches vs Nadal, wasn’t he?’ Really? Or did jane say this?

What jane had said was “I remember when Nole retired at the AO, Fed said something to the effect of “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play.” So I would imagine he holds himself to those same standards. I guess it’s all or nothing: either “no excuses” for a loss…”

You are plagiarizing and parroting an incorrect ‘quote’ and context mentioned by jane. You have no idea whether Federer actually said it. Given your track record of ignorance, how can we trust anything you keep making up?

I promise you Federer never said “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play.” I’ve asked jane to give me the exact quote but she hasn’t of course. And of course when I asked because I already know what the exact quote is and the context it was said.

What Federer actually said was “you know what, if you’re not fit enough, just get out of here” in the context of players who habitually call trainers and stop the flow of the matches to disrupt their opponent’s mental momentum and give themselves a better chance to win. Contrary to what jane assumed, it had nothing to do with Djokovic’s retirement — it was really about Djokovic’s habit of calling the trainer out. Novak was once rebuked by Federer in their 2006 Davis Cup clash between Serbia and Switzerland after taking an unnecessary injury time out in his close match against Wawrinka. At the 2008 U.S. Open, an exasperated Roddick said of Novak, “He’s either quick to call a trainer or he’s the most courageous guy of all time.”

Q. “You’re not a man that normally calls for trainers. Do you have a view on the habit of players to call trainers and possibly stop matches in the flow of the matches currently and whether that’s right or wrong?”

ROGER FEDERER: “Yeah, I mean, it’s a fine line, isn’t it? We’ll never find the perfect scenario for that. What shall I say? I never usually call the trainer. Exactly.

When I came out on the tour and I was young, and I — back then the rule was different. You couldn’t — what was it, a toilet break any time you wanted except obviously between the two games you were on the court. So you could basically take it at 6-5 in the third set. So that’s changed. Now you can only take them on set breaks, which I think really works out well now.

But then with the trainer, I guess it’s a tough thing. I really felt when I was coming up the young players abused it, especially against a player like me. A little bit unsecure [sic] about finishing matches, you lose a set easy, and then you go to the toilet and call the trainer and strap your ankle. Next thing you know, you’re twenty minutes extra out on the court. Things go through your mind.

Then once I got out on center court, you know, I guess I got the respect I deserved. People stop doing it against you. I think that’s nice, in a way. Probably on the outside courts it’s still being abused at times. It’s there to be used, so why not use it to give yourself a better chance to win? You don’t fly to Australia to not give it your best shot.

I’m almost in favor to just say, you know what, if you’re not fit enough, just get out of here.

But if something really bad happens, okay, it is just unfortunate, I guess. It’s a tough call. I mean, I don’t know. I guess we’ll speak about it and see what happens.”
http://www.goroger.net/interview/2009/ausopen090127qt.php

Steve 27: “Dave.’For god’s sake Skorocel, learn the facts before opening your mouth’. Fundamentalist, Dave. Again” OK , let me rephrase it: For god’s sake Steve 27 and Skorocel, learn the facts before both of you open your mouth. You ignorant Federer-hating fundamentalists obviously do not understand the meaning of “fundamentalist”.


Dave Says:

Skorocel: “after seeing Federer losing 2/3 of their 27 matches & more often than not crumbling mentally to his Spanish rival (who time and time again showed us that he’s simply the better player when it comes to really put a stamp on the match), only an idiot would think something else attributed to it…” Only an idiotic denier would see Federer beat Nadal 5-2 over a span of 18 months and then suddenly lose 0-5 over a span of 9 months yet deny there was something else at work other than the greatest player of all time suddenly mentally crumbling and Nadal suddenly becoming the better player.

Skorocel: “I’m not that stupid to think Federer’s losses to Nadal in 2008 (especially the ones at Wimby & RG) had to do anything with mono ;-) As far as I know, Federer never mentioned any illness or whatever as being even partially responsible for these defeats.” You have to first be intelligent enough to know whether or not you are stupid. Federer’s respected fitness and conditoning coach Pierre Paganini — who is the expert on Federer’s team on Roger’s fitness and the impact of mono — said before the 2009 US Open: “Last year (2008), Federer lacked always two or three percent. Glandular fever (mononucleosis) is a really hard thing. And then the back pain came in the fall, that did not help either. I would say that from 2009 he was again his old self. But it was sensational, the way he fought through everything in 2008, even though he was limited. That limitation makes a big difference at this high level, and challenged him mentally to the extreme. 2008 was from the mental side one of his best years.”
http://gototennis.com/2009/10/27/pierre-paganini-on-roger-federer-as-long-as-he-plays-he-will-be-strong/

Skorocel: “I’m not that stupid… Fact is, in Wimby 2008, he didn’t lose a single set en route to the final & overall was playing on a very good level throughout the whole tournament.” It was a combination of Federer’s exceptional grass court talent as well as luck he did not face a top player on the way to the final who could have tested him. The players Federer faced were all ranked No. 27, No. 41, No. 43, No. 53, No. 75, No. 273. If you examine his matches, Federer was winning mostly behind his serve. Only when he reached the final did Federer face his first top 26 player — No. 2 Nadal. Only then did he face an opponent who could expose his 2% to 3% deficiency resulting from the bout of mononucleosis


Swiss Maestro Says:

Here is the deal :

Federer is 2-10 against the Greatest clay courter of all time at his prime. who happens to be 5 years younger than him (5years in tennis is half a generation)

Nadal is 0-7 against his greatest rival in the last one year.

Borg never won USopen.

Laver is too far removed from the modern era.

The rest of the all time greats have far bigger loopholes in their resumes.

Federer is the Greatest among equals as of today. Anyone who disputes that has got his head too far up his @$$.


contemperory Says:

@Swiss Maestro:

It has been a while since you have posted? I don’t remember seeing your posts recently..

From what I read, it is pretty much believed amongst the federer fans that Fed lost his edge towards Nadal because of his Mono. Whereas Federer has never said that his losses are due to Mono, his trainer and his fans believe thats the reason.

As Jane says, in such a case, we can attribute many of the losses (by others including Nadal) for reasons like this.May be we should sit back and enjoy this golden era rather than putting blame on injury, illness etc and fighting over who is better b/w Fed and Rafa or Rafa or Djoko etc.


jane Says:

Dave I didn’t claim to be quoting Fed; from my first post on the matter i wrote “I remember when Nole retired at the AO, Fed said something to the effect of “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play.” ” – something to the effect of…

Your quote is not *that* far off from what I wrote “What Federer actually said was “you know what, if you’re not fit enough, just get out of here” ”

With regards to context, I think you’re exaggerating when you say “it had nothing to do with Djokovic’s retirement ” — nothing? You are quoting Fed’s post-match interview on the day Nole retired, and the question before the one you posted was precisely about the retirement. That was the overriding context that lead to the question about trainers.

http://vanessavcchen.pixnet.net/blog/post/7145425-讓我們看看費葛格怎麼說

I am glad you agree that the same standards should be applied to players “on principle” but I think in practice too. Otherwise what’s the point of the principle.

The way I see it, Nadal and Fed are different people and have different physiologies, one perhaps more prone to illness (chest infections, mono) one more prone to injuries (knees, abs, toes); moreover, they were raised differently and have different teams around them, which may cause them to react differently when situations arise. That may be why Nadal panics more when he feels like he may have an injury, whereas Fed stays calm so far as we can tell.

But the principle of how a fan feels about the loss explanation issue should still stand imo, regardless of the fact that they are different. You may prefer one to the other of course, which is fine. That’s a different matter when it comes to principles I believe.


jane Says:

But Dave, I realize that it’s easy to let our personal preferences or biases, whatever you want to call them, impact our reactions. I know I am not immune to this and because Nole is my favourite and my Murray second, things that they do which bother other posters don’t bother me as much. So I get it. No one is immune to this, I’d imagine. I sure ain’t. Just wanted to clarify that. It’s great to have principles but applying them consistently and across the board is not that easy.


Dave Says:

jane, when you said “Fed said something to the effect of” it means ‘Fed said something with the basic meaning, sense, purpose of’.

Thus what you wrote (“I think if we use illness to explain losses (in part) then it’s fair to use injuries (e.g., Fed’s mono IN 2008 or Nadal’s stomach tear at USO 2009)…. I remember when Nole retired at the AO, Fed said something to the effect of “if you’re not well enough, then don’t play.” So I would imagine he holds himself to those same standards.”) suggested Federer said don’t if you’re sick or injured — in other words if you show up on court, don’t use your injury or sickness as excuses.

Federer actually said “you know what, if you’re not fit enough, just get out of here”. Federer clearly said this in response to the question “Do you have a view on the habit of players to call trainers and possibly stop matches in the flow of the matches currently and whether that’s right or wrong?” What Federer actually said was “you know what, if you’re not fit enough, just get out of here” in the context of players who habitually call trainers and stop the flow of the matches to disrupt their opponent’s mental momentum and give themselves a better chance to win.

Contrary to what you assumed, jane, it’s you who exaggerated. This issue had nothing to do with Djokovic’s retirement other than it appeared in the same interview. The primary context that led to Federer’s comment was players who habitually call out trainers that disrupts the flow of matches. So what if “Fed’s post-match interview was on the day Nole retired” or that “the question before the one you posted was precisely about the retirement”. That was incidental. Federer was referrig to the MTO in his answer, not retirements. Indeed, on the retirement issue Federer’s key comments were that Djokovic retired while losing and that Andy Roddick fully deserved the match for pushing Djokovic to the limits leading to retirement. Djokovic has a long history of various issues (calling medical time outs, retirements, ball bouncing, chest thumping, gamesmanship, arrogant comments, etc, etc) that are not necesarily connected to the degree that allows you to misinterpret what Federer actually said.

Nadal’s big team with PR staff may be the reason why we are led to perceive Nadal panics more when he feels like he may have an injury, whereas Fed’s smaller team without PR staff may be the reason why we presume Fed stays calm.

Bottom line, this has nothing to do with biases. It’s just good business. In business, managers have to make decisions everyday about which staff are genuinely sick or injured (because they prone to it or really have it) and which staff are milking the gullibility of sympathizers to their slacking. If it’s the latter, at some point they have to call out such staff. Who better to ask than players themselves if Nadal is exaggerating his ailments while Federer downplays his ailments.


Sienna Says:

Skorocel Says:
Sienna: Sorry to disappoint you, but I’m not that stupid to think Federer’s losses to Nadal in 2008 (especially the ones at Wimby & RG) had to do anything with mono ;-)

Skorocel.. Youre missing the point. I already stated that without 2008 and the mono Fed probably would not have been the player he is today. Heck maybe he digged the Haas match out in 2009 because what he went through during 2008. So sacrificing 2 slams for his maiden Garros was a bargain.

But people can put asterix’s on Fed’s win when Nadal loses in fourth round then also you could use the same asterix’s when Fed is not at 100%.

Have a good one.


Sienna Says:

Dave
I can keep on reading youre posts.. They are poetry and pay true hommage to The Mighty Fed.


Skorocel Says:

contemperory: „From what I read, it is pretty much believed amongst the federer fans that Fed lost his edge towards Nadal because of his Mono. Whereas Federer has never said that his losses are due to Mono, his trainer and his fans believe thats the reason.

That’s right. Now guess why he’s never said that? Was it because he didn’t want to be a sore loser or was it because, deep inside, he thinks Nadal’s simply the better player when these two play, mono/duo/stereo or not?

P.S. Judging from the comments provided by our news correspondent Dave, I don’t think Paganini’s said it either. All he‘s said was that „Federer was 2 or 3 % less and bla bla“, not that he lost to Nadal because of mono, LOL ;-) Frankly, why would he say that when everyone including him (and except you & Dave) knows the truth? To make a laughing stock of himself?


jane Says:

Dave, I disagree, on both counts – context and it having nothing to do with biases. I have no real vested interest in this topic anyhow, as I am not particularly a fan of Fed or of Nadal, though I appreciate both in different ways, for different reasons. My point was just about principle. I’ve made it.


Sienna Says:

When Fed is of with 2/3 % and noticable by his fitness trainer then you bet your ass it would be noticable in a matchup between FEDAL.

I am not claiming he would ever have won the Garros final but he would be a big favorite against him at Wimbly.SO him oerturning 2/3 matches of the 5 played we were discussing is pretty plausible.. Hence h2h is not a fair means of judging players.


Swiss Maestro Says:

Hi contemperory:

I have not posted much the last few months. I post more on tennis.com these days.

great to read nice posts from Federer fans like you.

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