Tom Gainey. Thanks a lot for all that coverage. Much appreciated.

February 1st, 2013 at 1:42 pm

^Yeah me too^.

February 1st, 2013 at 1:45 pm

I don’t know where else to put this: Djokovic has 19 aces in his match so far. They are not playing on any standard clay…

February 1st, 2013 at 1:54 pm

From another blog: Austria provided an indoor clay court that sounds just like it for a tie
against Australia once. Looking at the history it must have been the tie in
Vienna 3-5 Feb 1989. From memory the visitors thought the court’s shifting
surface made it unplayable and dangerous too, and proceeded to lose 5-0.

February 1st, 2013 at 2:23 pm

I sneezed 2.5 times today. Just wanted to keep you abreast of latest developments..that’s all.

February 1st, 2013 at 2:39 pm

http://terratv.terra.cl/videos/Deportes/Mas-Deportes/4411-451135/Presidente-Pinera-recibio-a-Rafael-Nadal-en-La-Moneda.htm
Rafa and the President. Gonzo is there as well!
Oh boy, they are certainly giving Rafa royal treatment! He deserves it. VamosKing

February 1st, 2013 at 2:46 pm

Nice to see Mr. Big Shot Forehand. ATP tennis balls want me to tell you they are glad you are gone!

February 1st, 2013 at 4:05 pm

What happened to Kvitova? she is losing matches left and right.

February 1st, 2013 at 5:07 pm

The same thing that happened to Ana Ivanovic. A quick major win and then collapse.

February 1st, 2013 at 5:18 pm

nadal losing his hair on top doping does that he should be drug tested a lot

February 1st, 2013 at 6:04 pm

Why no Funk/Trunk change, tennis-x? It’s been five days since the Oz final. Lazy.

February 1st, 2013 at 6:17 pm

I hope doubles can win so Nole doesn’t have to play another match on that “clay.” I was surprised when I saw this mornig he served 20 aces. It looks by result Nole was clinical. At least now he is even with Rohus, one of the few players he had negative H2H. Troicki came back from 0:2 to beat Goffin 3:2. I really hope doubles can finish the job.

February 1st, 2013 at 6:33 pm

Sorry, wrong thread.

February 1st, 2013 at 6:34 pm

@grisham

It’s not quite so dramatic. Kvitova won 2011 WTA Tour Championships in Istanbul following her Wimbledon triumph. Last year, she reached two semis, a quarter and a 4th round – respectable. And she is still #8, just.

Still, you do sense it could go all to pot. She has, imo, more weapons than Ivanovic, but at the same time, she seems to be more fragile. She’s a player you really do watch with your heart in your mouth – you simply have no idea what sort of shot she’ll play at any given moment. If she gets into a rhythm, she looks queen of the world, calm and lethal. And then she’ll do something so bizarre you can’t imagine what any trainer would have to say about it. Technical advice would seem, somehow, rather beside the point.

Watching her match with Laura Robson at the AO was a strange experience. 5 strokes was a long rally in a long and somewhat dull match so far as the tennis was concerned, though it was nerve racking all the same. Robson is, as Heather Watson remarked, very similar to Kvitova in style. She is also similarly unpredictable, although in her case it’s due to lack of experience. Whereas Kvitova is frankly borderline mental at times.

Kvitova has it all there, at least in embryo. Is she going to be one of these players of whom you wonder: when is all that talent going to unfold? And you keep wondering, year after year, until one day you just shake your head, sadly thinking of what might have been…..

February 1st, 2013 at 7:01 pm

it seem she is lost confidence grendel and she is struggling to get it back. She was sick with viral infection or similar at the end of the last year. In the whole Asian swing she couldn’t win a match in three tournaments. Instead of staying away and recover, she continue to play, that might have caused more damage to her confidence i believe.

She didn’t do too bad last year, she lost in the semi to sharapova at the aussie open, qtr to serena at wimbledon, qtrs to sharapova at the french. Won couple of tournaments before losing early at the USO.

I hope she gets it back. I like to watch her and i think she is very talented.

February 1st, 2013 at 8:27 pm

Rafael Nadal went to the restroom, Knee Is OK and he is able to sit and rise. This is ridiculous… And what, he will play against people ranking 250 and above???

February 1st, 2013 at 8:43 pm

Rafael Nadal went to the restroom, Knee Is OK and he is able to sit and rise.
–
I have been resting, getting ready. I appreciate you keeping the ordinary folk informed.

February 1st, 2013 at 8:52 pm

Why no Funk/Trunk change, tennis-x? It’s been five days since the Oz final. Lazy.
–
All of Tennis-x’s resources are being spent on your Humble Highness. Minute to minute update, who cares about Funk/Trunk?

February 1st, 2013 at 8:53 pm

Knee feels better? Surprise surprise!!
Wait…. Are u sure this time?

February 1st, 2013 at 11:59 pm

I am going to bed..last update of the night.

February 2nd, 2013 at 12:52 am

http://www.atpworldtour.com/News/Tennis/2013/02/5/Nadal-Launches-Tennis-Academy-App.aspx?
Clever app. Good luck in your new project Rafa!

February 2nd, 2013 at 3:38 am

My knee is still fine. All is well.

February 2nd, 2013 at 1:23 pm

There is a Swiss Davis cup match going deeeeep in the 5th. I know his Kingness is not playing. Still good stuff.

February 2nd, 2013 at 1:29 pm

Thanks for that link Giles,great to see Rafas thinking about the future of the game.

February 2nd, 2013 at 1:54 pm

http://espn.go.com/tennis/story/_/id/8908098/rafael-nadal-keeps-expectations-low-entering-return

Choice quote:
“He says he passed six blood and urine doping tests since then and supports strict controls to keep tennis clean.”

Coming chattering class spin: The ATP went all out to test Nadal to make sure he comes back clean after serving his silent ban……sigh.

Compare and contrast:

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/20199271

“”I feel I’m being less tested now than six, seven, eight years ago,” said the world number one.

“I don’t know the reasons we are being tested less…….”

That would be the royal “we” in there eh……
#PseudoFedisFed

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/tennis/murray-lets-flush-out-the-drug-cheats.19282031

“They came to the hotel on Saturday and it was completely random,” Murray said. “I think that’s good. We’re not used to doing that many blood tests in tennis – I’ve probably had four or five blood tests this year – so it’s something that’s obviously necessary.”

February 2nd, 2013 at 2:28 pm

7 hrs 2 min
Swiss lose.

February 2nd, 2013 at 2:53 pm

Commentator on TC just said the crowd at Rafa’s practice in Chile this morning was like a Bieber concert!!

February 2nd, 2013 at 3:36 pm

Hate Bieber! There was an excellent film by Spike Lee on the great Michael Jackson which, however, for some reason kept featuring some callow youth called Justin Bieber. Who is this Bieber creature, I asked my son, and why does he look so pleased with himself. Just some pop crap, he replied dismissively.

February 2nd, 2013 at 3:48 pm

First my update..
Practice went well. All my important parts seem to be working fine.

Poor “Best Backhand in Switzerland”. First he loses to the Egg Lover in AO, then loses a 7 hour match, double fault on last point.

February 2nd, 2013 at 4:22 pm

In other unrelated matter, I am so sad. My beloved country is losing to some country named Canada. I mean, Canada is a US State like Texas, or so I thought.

February 2nd, 2013 at 4:29 pm

grendel,

I have stopped GOT atm, as the tele series is starting up soon, and want ro keep pace.

Re; Bad25 film, it was most excellent. Genius stuff! Too bad the media killed him :(. Now we all look back and find out how truly talented he was. Will never be another one like em.

February 2nd, 2013 at 4:39 pm

skeezer

never realised how SHY Michael Jackson was; considering who he was, that was sort of a magical thing. I heard some fools discussing the film claiming it dodged the controversial stuff. What fools fools fools. What we saw was a portrait of a very unusual and apparently sweet man who was undeniably troubled (who wouldn’t be with that background) and was a unique artist. What about that bending, eh – I like the guy who said he still couldn’t figure out how he did it.

So you gonna watch tv series, then read the book, do it that way round? Well, why not. The third book is by far the best – there’s a passion and sustained intensity to the book which just floored me. It’s so long, I believe they’re goin to devote 2 tv series to it. Just as well, since poor old GRR writes at the pace of – well, as he said to some irate fans:”I can’t write as fast as you guys read….”. Questions is, will he make it to the end before the tv boys catch up with him?

February 2nd, 2013 at 6:55 pm

I have mixed feelings about Michael Jackson – i mean I love some of his earlier music, and his dancing is outrageous, but I am not a fan of his type of pop music generally speaking (anything post-Thriller is meh for me). But then there is all the strange stuff at Neverland, or whatever it was called, his marriage to Lisa Marie, his adopted kids,etc. It’s difficult to completely overlook, regardless of his horrible background. It’s a sad story, though, and with a sad end.

February 2nd, 2013 at 7:26 pm

Jane, you forgot to mention the creepiest thing about him – the surgical addiction and the progressive whittling away of his nose.
I am endlessly baffled by the way intelligent people online, treat pop as if it were really music.
It is a close equivalent of tabloid journalism – slick, professional, shallow and facile. People who would be insulted by the suggestion they read only tabloids are, when it comes to music, satisfied with pop. How can this be?
Jackson was a superb dancer, but of course that is purely visual. Good music is stuff one LISTENS TO, and it can be appreciated by the blind.
I used to watch pop videos of Blondie when Debbie Harry was in her prime, but I wasn’t motivated by musical considerations!

February 2nd, 2013 at 9:00 pm

Decide to take a break from posting due to the mud slinging matches in between tournies, but thought let’s see what’s going on in TX world and to my pleasant surprise discussions on MJ is what i find.

Who’s bad?

LOL, my thoughts: The guy is an undeniable music legend. An icon who has influenced contemporary music more than any other artist.

He’s the standard they wish to match.

At his best his music, the dance moves etc were just entertainment of the highest order.

50 years from now his name will be remembered alongside FRANK SINATRA, ELVIS PRESLEY and THE BEATLES.

Why?

Since they had an impact on music and popular culture by extension in a way that no other artist has even come close to in the last 100 years.

At his best he hit a height that we ain’t likely going to see again.

You turn on the radio or tune into to a music station today and all you see is imitators of the man.

The best compliment to his talent really.

Unfortunately, he clearly suffered from having a tough childhood, and his private life became the focus of public interest for the last 10-20 years of his life.

How much of it was true and how much falsehood?

Who knows.

I have always found it strange how the most gifted of popular culture artists also seem to have a troublesome private life.

The gift and the curse i guess.

Fact is, he’s unfortunately deceased so one should remember the best moments of his musical genius as opposed to his private life: since ultimately that’s what it is- HIS private life!

RIP MJ!

February 2nd, 2013 at 9:49 pm

PS:

Seeing as we are somewhat off topic, have any of the resident bloggers seen any of the following films from last year:

THE MASTER, AMOUR, LES MISERABLES, SILVER LININGS PLAYBOOK, ZERO DARK THIRTY.

All truly outstanding films, in year that surprisingly saw many great films being released.

February 2nd, 2013 at 9:55 pm

‘for some reason kept featuring some callow youth called Justin Bieber. Who is this Bieber creature, I asked my son, and why does he look so pleased with himself. Just some pop crap, he replied dismissively.’

ROFL!

February 2nd, 2013 at 9:59 pm

Brando, the phrase “popular culture” is an oxymoron.
Jackson influenced nothing except the pop of which he was part.
The only original contribution to western music to come from the USA has been jazz and blues, which ironically would not exist but for slavery.
Watered down for mass consumption, jazz spawned the likes of Bing Crosby and Frank Sinatra, who sold proportionately as many records as Jackson, the record industry not being so developed in their day. In the same way, black rhythm-and-blues spawned rock ‘n’ roll and Presley.
“Greatest influence in last 100 years”?
Come on! Try Louis Armstrong, for one.
I won’t be around in the fifty years you mention, but if you are, I think you will find that by then Jackson’s records will interest only the kind of nostalgia specialists who now collect 1920s dance music. The manufacturers of pop WANT their product to be ephemeral, so they can start a new fashion every so often and reap the profits. Why should that change?

February 3rd, 2013 at 12:42 am

Well, truly appreciate the posts on MJ knowing that this is a tennis blog, so excuse my embellishment also, and then will post back to Tennis.

First of all, jane, I actually found his later work (Dangerous and History ) deeper and richer, more mature, and surely less pop ( gone too soon, earth song, etc ). His Bad album imo was his best ever with his followup tour, and made him (along with Thriller)legend. The sellout crowds globally are legendary.

His remarkable 40 years of hit making music and dance include genres from The greats of Motown to the great dancer era (Astaire and Kelly) and the great acting era of Taylor, Brando, etc. he recognized it, respected it, embraced it, and infused it into his art. There is no other artist today that embraces all the art of song and dance like MJ had. He sang a tribute at Sammy Davis Jr Bday, and Elizabeth Taylors also, but was still connected and collaborated with the artists of today like Will I. am, Neyo and Akon. I mean tell me what artist besides the Beatles, Elvis, compares?

So the critique? He was an undeniable genius. What genuis in history wasn’t without issues? He was a performer, a entertainer, and what actor / entertainer doesn’t surgically enhance there face? Did he go to extremes? Sure, it was a fault of his no doubt. If he just kept that perfect face in the 80′s…..but obviously he could not stop.

Most don’t realize Michael was an avid book reader of the arts, was a accomplished painter, loved the classic music artists of Bach and Beethoven, and gave more more money to charitable organizations than any entertainer ever.

His whole Neverland thing and missing childhood made sense to me, and when he was cleared of the 14 bogus charges, thats right, 14, completely innocent, I was not surprised.

Has anyone been a superstar at 8years old? He did not have the normal life, but was destined to become something special. So when you become that, you are not like everyone else.

Its true what the music legends of today say, that is, a man or woman may have a controversial life, but a genuis in the arts usually does. But when the smoke clears, the years past, the music, the art , remains. And the appreciation of the artistic value, and contribution to the art will be the shining lasting impression that will endure for all time.

For those interested in the man, which is a very interesting read, “the man and the music” by JosepthVogel

February 3rd, 2013 at 1:08 am

Michael Jackson?He was OK, but not genius…His dancing is widly copied-yes.His influence enormus-yes.His music came from soul, funk, disco (Jackson 5 ) but so many other artist.
He did not write Thriller song but Rod Temperton.And he dona album with Quincy Jones (now, that is truly great artist )I much prefered music of Prince-he wrote every single song.
So, if you look who is greatest entertainer in last 40 years-I gues Michael Jackson.But the greatest artist-musician?He is up there but not the greatest…

February 3rd, 2013 at 1:25 am

Courban,

Yes Prince is good. But no MJ, ha. He wants to be though, he tries so hard to copy him through all his pop music career to no avail. Never sold the record albums and hits the MJ did,
MJ did not write Thriller, but he wrote Billy Jean, and a ton of other hits. He single handedly made MTV and basically invented the “music video”.

Loved Prince’s guitar work though, for a pop guy.

February 3rd, 2013 at 2:04 am

courbon,

Keep it up, I am with you on this one, though my music knowledge starts and finish with “Ibarska magistrala” and “Skadarlija.”
Sorry people, I was never fan of MJ, and it is not only me but quite a few people that I know, again sorry but something wasn’t right with him from whatever reason, his Aussie “wife” etc. Wouldn’t leave my kid with him for a nanosecond.

Brando,

Never ever put Sinatra along MJ, Sinatra is in the league of his own, he “did it his way.” That includes Sammy Davis jr and Din Martin. They lived their lifes in full, MJ didn’t have a life.

February 3rd, 2013 at 2:04 am

“for whatever reason”

February 3rd, 2013 at 2:08 am

And all I did was post a comment from a TC commie on audience comparisons! Lol. Turned into a musical thread!!
Btw MJ – the best!

February 3rd, 2013 at 2:50 am

Giles,

It is all your fault.

February 3rd, 2013 at 3:00 am

Wog boy. I know. It also just shows how easily one’s mind strays! Lol

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:08 am

Wog boy. Guilty as charged! It also shows how easily one’s mind strays! Lol

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:12 am

Sorry, double post, with slight variation.

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:14 am

I only saw Beiber sing once and thought he was totally tuneless,and to be honest i couldnt name anyone of his songs,have to say im with Courbon in that i love MJs music,but Prince for me has more of an edge,and i have listened to Purple Rain twice already this morning,wow what a classic and such an amazing record,anyway many great men have made classic records,but what about the women too Ella Fitzgerald,Roberta Flack,Aretha Franklin,Dione Warwick,and whatever peoples feelings are about her,its still amazing that Madonnas been in the buisness for as long as she has,my two cents.

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:39 am

Collin i used to enjoy Blondies music,when i was at school the girls wanted to look like her,and the boys all wanted to sleep with her.

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:45 am

@Skeezer:I’m not trying to diminished work of MJ.Hi is very good.But, music is my ‘niche’ and you are very wrong in saying that Prince tried to copy MJ.Princes influencises are Jimmy Hendrix, Sly and Family Stone and similair-he is mostly influence by Funk and Rock, and MJ is more Soul and Disco (with some Funk element ).Mj wrote Billy Jean but Prince wrote Purple rain.Mj wrote Beat it,Prince wrote ‘When Doves cry’.Remember, Prince wrote all songs himself, MJ did not wrote alone…
And as you can measure success by influence-its not completely right.In biggest pole of musicians ( of today ), biggest influence was David Bowie and then Beatles and so long…And if you conduct all new kids, pop Idols, bands and similiair I bet they will put Madonna on the top of their influence-which does not mean she is the best ( do, very good, and I respect her-she is not great singer, most song written by others etc…).Again, MJ was very good, but not greatest artist by my opinion and many others opinion…
@Alison;You listened to Purple rain this morning?So, you must feel bit frisky and bit sexy…Your husband is a lucky man.
@Wog Boy:Nothing wrong with ‘Skadarlija’, that kind of music comes from heart.. ( lots of music today is way to comercialised and right silly-when 16 year old sings about his great loves , or great life experiences-you wonder how at such a tender age?)

February 3rd, 2013 at 5:34 am

courbon,

You are too young to know that acutally one of the first, if not the first Disco Club was in Skadarlija, how odd considering that Skadarlija is bohemian part of the city and has nothing to do with pop or disco music. That was at the very beginnig of 70s and name of the club was “Monokl”, I was skipping the school to go to Monokl until my father found out … I am too embarrassed to say what happened then:(

February 3rd, 2013 at 6:05 am

@Disco Boy:Ah, you naughty boy…I heard about that club, but way before my time.I used to go to ‘Akademija’,SKC and KST.Mid to Late 80′s, when to see Partibrejkers, Orgazam i similair….

February 3rd, 2013 at 6:36 am

Courbon lol thanks very much for saying that,you have made my day,its true i have listened to Purple Rain twice this morning,as its one of my favorite ever songs,the rest i will have to leave for some other time as hubby has the flu at the moment lol ;)

February 3rd, 2013 at 6:41 am

Wog boy. I see the musical theme continues. I ought to spank my wrists for starting this! Lol

February 3rd, 2013 at 6:44 am

@Alison:With pleasure.I can not agree more about Purple Rain-greatest ballad ever.Off the topic-have you heard about about Newcastle and Chelsea game?Ouuch…You northeners are good!Let see today Liverpool-tough game.I’m in Rugby Land (South West France ) so I’m watching Rugby today with local peasant (nice guy, drinks too much…)

February 3rd, 2013 at 6:51 am

Giles,

It is all your fault. I am out of this conversation since some posters get upset when we are not talking tennis and I just realised that this is not Nole’s thread, so I shouldn’t be doing this on other than Nole’s threads;)

February 3rd, 2013 at 7:11 am

alison,
6:41am,

I am a bit slow so I just realised now what you meant with that flu thing, naughty alison … naughty courbon.
I am out of here;)

February 3rd, 2013 at 7:19 am

Courbon lol us northeners are good well sometimes anyway,i was delighted for Newcastle as i cant stand Chelsea,even though Man Utd are an amazing side i cant stand SAF either or his hook or by crook methods of winning at all costs,Liverpool FC do have a tough game today,and to be honest i will be happy if they get a point,i hope you enjoy your Rugby not a sport i could ever get into except for the New Zealand all Blacks.

February 3rd, 2013 at 7:27 am

@Alison:Thanx.Well, I don’t have a clue about Rugby but I’m willing to give a shot…Game is starting so I better move.Good luck this afternoon (City is damn good side)
@Disco/Wog Boy:By my calculations its late evening in Skippy Land so ‘Laku Noc’ and speak to you soon.

February 3rd, 2013 at 8:22 am

Courbon no me neither but enjoy the Rugby anyway.
Wogboy try to enjoy the football,as Courbon says city are a damn good side(unfortunatly),dont worry about going off topic,we all do at times,its not too bad as long as it doesnt turn into mud slinging,i hope LVC get some sort of result even if its just a draw,BTW lol naughty but nice my hubby has got the flu honestly,(ahem) anyway im so happy to see back playing,and i hope he can shake of the rust and have a good week.

February 3rd, 2013 at 9:04 am

@brando

Re; SILVER LININGS PLAYBOOK
Great flick ;)

February 3rd, 2013 at 9:06 am

@Colin:” The manufacturers of pop WANT their product to be ephemeral, so they can start a new fashion every so often and reap the profits.” The idea, of course, is equivalent to “built in obsolescence” for manufactured items – no good making perfect shoes: put everyone out of work.

However, where so-called pop music is concerned, this is one of these massive generalisations which doesn’t mean a lot when you examine it. For example, what actually is pop? Were the Beatles pop? Does it matter whether they were or not? And b.t.w., after 50 years they are still much listened to and no doubt they will be in 50 years time. What about another from that era – Jimi Hendrix, what is he? Imagine a “manufacturer of pop” inventing jimi Hendrix. Or Bob Dylan?

Is “grunge” pop? Are the different types of metal? What about alternative rock – industrial say, or ambient? Quite obviously they are not, although no doubt sleezy entrpreneurs try to get their oar in here, as anywhere. But to people who don’t have any real acquaintance with non-classical music, anything which isn’t classical music or possibly jazz (that is sometimes allowed)it all sounds the same. No doubt to some, Bach and Wagner are peddling the same sort of stuff.

Not that I am any expert, mind. I get my info here from my 17 year old son. He is quite a talented pianist, getting his grade 8 at age of 14 on a minimum of practice, and I can assure you that is unusual – but the reason I mention this is not to boast vicariously (although to my shame I have done that) but to point out to Colin that my son was trained in classical music and was pretty good at it. However, he never listens to it, and now never plays it. But he DOES listen to music – all the time. ” Good music is stuff one LISTENS TO,” says Colin, and this is exactly what my son claims to be doing. He understands music and loves it with passion.

The term “popular music” is about as helpful as “popular fiction”. Most popular music is rubbish – but so is most classical music. Most anything is more or less rubbish. Most popular fiction is instantly binnable, most “serious fiction” is instantly forgettable. People are at last beginning to understand that there are just books – some are good and some are bad, and then you can subdivide from there if that sort of thing grabs you. The same is true of music.

February 3rd, 2013 at 11:10 am

^great post and very true

February 3rd, 2013 at 11:33 am

grendel, yeah I don’t think genres denote quality in themselves. It’s just marketing to some degree.

But you forgot trance and Norwegian death metal. ;)

February 3rd, 2013 at 11:40 am

grendel,

to add very intrigued about your Sons talent on the Piano. I play a little guitar, but would have loved to been able to learn the Piano. Have always felt the better song writing instrument(the Piano), but maybe I am wrong there for someone else. If he(Son) loves music, and the creation thereof, would again encourage the read of “the Man in the Music” by Vogel.

“To live is to be musical, starting with the blood dancing in your veins. Everything living has a rhythm. Do you feel your music?”
― Michael Jackson”

February 3rd, 2013 at 12:10 pm

@Skeezer:That is all time great disco tune…

February 3rd, 2013 at 12:25 pm

Skeezer – nice quote, though Louis Armstrong’s:”it don’t mean a thing if you ain’t got that swing” is more pithy. But rhythm is everything, not just in music, in literature. True too in tennis, in life – that’s my feeling. The lack of it can be a killer.

Meanwhile, how about this for a smooth transition from discussion of music to tennis? You don’t often see tennis employed as metaphor, but I came across quite an ingenious use of it in the novel I’m currently reading (Jeffrey Eugenides’ The Marriage Plot).

Leonard is currently struggling to get it up following a serious depression and “Madeleine wasn’t sure what to do. Should she pay more attention to Leonard’s problem, or less? She’d never been particularly hands-on in bed. Life hadn’t required it. Guys hadn’t seemed to care, or to notice, being so hands-on themselves. One night, she tackled the problem as she might a drop shot on the tennis court: she ran full out, getting there seemingly in time, then bent low and flicked her return – which hit the tape and fell back, dead, on her side of the court. She didn’t try again after that. She stayed back, playing her usual baseline game.”

February 3rd, 2013 at 2:13 pm

^ Love Eugenides but haven’t read that book; is it good grendel? Have you read his other work?

February 3rd, 2013 at 2:16 pm

A few observations on Grendel’s posting:
Yes, the Beatles were pop, and yes it matters because – surprise – their music was not important AS MUSIC. The tunes were catchy and the lyrics often amusing, but “catchy” and “amusing” don’t amount to a whole lot, do they?
As I was young when the Beatles arrived, people assume I must have been a fan, but I paid no attention to them at the time, as I was busy discovering classical music, and soon afterwards jazz.
And finally, Grendel, with all due respect, if someone trained in classical music never listens to it or plays it, that is very, very SAD, and I have to say, lazy. That had better be my final remark.
I cannot read a note of music, or play any instrument, but oddly enough I think that supports my argument. The vast majority of people never listen to classical music at all, and think of it as an ivory tower, exclusive genre for snobs. But if I enjoy it, that proves it has something other than the purely technical side.
Most of the really fine tunes come from classical music, and there is enormous variety. Anyone who, as suggested, couldn’t tell the difference between Bach and Wagner, would have to be utterly and completely unmusical and virtually deaf,
Western classical music has been going for about 600 years, and includes the distinctive contributions of numerous national groups, so it’s hardly surprising that it has more variety than pop, which didn’t arrive until the 1940s,when there was for the first time a market opening as young people had money to spend.
By the way, claims that the Beatles, or whoever, will be listened to in 50 years are every bit as much mere assertions as anything I’ve said, because nobody will know until the 50 years have passed. I repeat what I said before: the Beatles, Jackson, Presley, the lot of them, will in 50 years be what 1920s dance music is now – quaint nostalgia listened to by a minority of specialist enthusiasts.

February 3rd, 2013 at 3:13 pm

Very apt that this thread has been hijacked by music lovers cos Rafa himself is a music lover!!!

February 3rd, 2013 at 3:39 pm

Giles whats Rafas fav type of music i cant seem to recall?

February 3rd, 2013 at 3:50 pm

colin,

What you don’t see is Jackson was born into Motown, which with soul, R&B. You’re talking about being around Smokey Robinson, Marvin Gaye, The Supremes, and the late great James Brown. None of the artists you mentioned ( Elvis, Beatles, ) became first a child music superstar. He starting touring at 8, had his first hit at 11. His body of work covers over 40 years! Then as an adult his music transcended from disco to pop, and then his later work fused into its own blend of R&B, Rock, Funk, while still bringing in artistic ballad anthems such as Earth Song and Man in the Mirror. if you dug deeper into his catalog, you would hear some classical tones, as well as bringing back ( And wonderfully sung ) one of the best little songs there ever was , “Smile”. Is that “POP”? No, its something else that went way beyond that. You have misinterpreted the man, and his music. How many of yesteryears singers could deliver a 4 octave range in the voice, and often would sing ALL the 5 part harmonies in the background to create his unique melodies. Unreal!

Guess what, its already been over 50 years since MJ came on the scene and MJ’s music still stands very tall.

Look, Sinatra, Armstrong, Elvis, Kelly, Astaire all took music, dance and entertaining a level up and stood the test of time. MJ took song, and dance, with influence from these guys, and took it to the stratosphere.

There is a reason this particular artist has the greatest selling album of all time.

Sorry, but his all time records will be remembered in another 50 years, as well as his music.

February 3rd, 2013 at 3:58 pm

Let us move to boxing, Skeezer, since you are in America is it true what they just said on the news that Ali is very sick and can die within days?

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:05 pm

alison. Not sure. I know he likes Spanish music (obviously) , I think he said he likes Boyzone. He loves the music from Phantom of the Opera (has seen the play numerous times). So all in all guess he likes a variety.

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:08 pm

Wogboy Ali has been very ill for a long time now,so it would not surprise me,and Gazza too but for very different reasons though obviously,BTW nice point for LVC today,should have had all 3 really grr shame about that Reina balls up though.

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:12 pm

Giles oh Boyzone cheesy,dont mind POTO though thats a fantastic musical.

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:14 pm

OK I have to say although hes not everybodys cup of tea,but i have to say what about Sir Cliff Richard? who has released records in 6 different decades 50s,60s,70s,80s,90s,00s,and is still going strong,as i say not to everyones taste but that must surely mean he will go down as one off the biggest artists ever.

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:32 pm

Check out this video on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnGUvA1JKn0&feature=youtube_gdata_player
alison. Short clip of Rafa’s practice a short while ago. Poor man is swamped by fans and security!!

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:38 pm

Giles thanks for the link,not that its a bad thing,but is Rafa receding some what,or is it my imagination?

February 3rd, 2013 at 4:44 pm

http://www.rafaholics.com/2011/04/grandfather-nadal-stages-kids-opera.html?m=1
alison. Did you know Rafa’s grandfather is (was) a musician/conductor. He conducted his last concert last year. I have posted an interesting article which you might like to read. Rafa likes classical music very much.
Yes, sadly his hair is receding. Has been for the last 3 years or so! Love him, hair or no hair!! Lol

February 3rd, 2013 at 5:00 pm

Nobody going to watch Superbowl? Niners!

February 3rd, 2013 at 5:08 pm

alison,

Thanks, haven’t seen the game, it was in the middle of the night here. Good to know they played well.

Skeezer is not talking to me anymore:(

February 3rd, 2013 at 5:29 pm

Colin

You are sincere but I believe mistaken in some respects – although there is the question of different perspectives.

“the Beatles were pop, and yes it matters because – surprise – their music was not important AS MUSIC” . Not important (whatever that means) according to whom, though? Leonard Bernstein, a great classical composer and conductor, highly rated the Beatles. The Times classical music critic from the late 60’s considered the Beatles songs to be on a par with Schubert. Personally, I think that kind of comparison invalid, since the types of music are so different – but still… Ravi Shankar, revered Indian classical composer and performer, obviously respected the Beatles. One could go on – Michael Berkeley, contemporary classical composer, for instance. But in any case, how do you define “musically important”? As for the next 50 years, it is true, none of us know, including you, and you make predictions. But the Beatles have lasted 50 years so far and are still enormously popular – and respected. It seems a pretty good bet that they will still be around in 50 years. And I definitely defer to Skeezer on Michael Jackson’s staying power.

“Most of the really fine tunes come from classical music, and there is enormous variety.” You’d be surprised how many of these tunes are folk based – i.e. originate from the popular music of the day. To name but a few, Beethoven, Schubert, Dvorjak, Brahms, Bartok, Janacek, Shostakovic, Vaughan Williams, Benjamin Britten all borrowed heavily from folk music (and some from jazz of course). In any case, important as melody is, who says it is the most important aspect of music? There is huge divergence here, not least between national cultures.

“Anyone who, as suggested, couldn’t tell the difference between Bach and Wagner, would have to be utterly and completely unmusical and virtually deaf,” Well, it was a bit of a rhetorical point – but the underlying point is sound, I think. That is that people who are not accustomed to classical music will find Wagner and Bach equally alien and disagreeable. They are not wrong or right, just educated, aurally speaking, differently to you or I.

“, if someone trained in classical music never listens to it or plays it, that is very, very SAD, and I have to say, lazy.” Why? My son, as a very young child, started off listening to classical music, probably because of me. But he is his own man, so to speak, and as he grew older, he discovered the music which suited him. Admittedly, it probably helped that I didn’t know anything about it. I don’t think you can accuse him of laziness. When he played people like Mozart – and also Jazz, actually – he applied himself and clearly understood the music. It was a pleasure to listen to him. But then he was ready to move on. What is wrong with that? Personally, I hope that one day he listens to at least some classical music again – but that is my particular prejudice speaking.

I asked him who his favourite musicians are at the moment, and his response was interesting. He named (after some thought, since he is a voracious listener) Grimes, Raveonettes and Twin Shadow. I have never heard of any of these people, and when I asked him if he thought they would still be listened to in 50 years, he said probably not (whereas he agreed that it was very likely that, for instance, the Beatles and Michael Jackson would still be popular). He meant no disrespect to their music, which he highly values. It is just that there is a great deal of very good music being composed and played – most of which is not commercial by the way – and there is just a limit to what people can absorb. The same is true in literature. All sorts of excellent stuff is virtually forgotten – simply too much around. Some is occasionally revived, and can do quite well.

So I think staying power is rather overated, and can be misleading too. How many people read Shakespear for pleasure – as opposed to being dragooned into doing so at school? Tiny, tiny amounts of people, i would suggest. Even a once writer of and for the people like Dickens is barely read outside academia and literary circles.

Music is the language of feeling and emotion. We make dogmatic generalisations concerning it at our peril.

February 3rd, 2013 at 6:18 pm

jane, am half way through the Eugenides. Yes, it’s pretty good, though I wouldn’t go overboard. I haven’t read any of his other stuff, no. So much to read….

February 3rd, 2013 at 6:25 pm

“Grimes, Raveonettes and Twin Shadow.” – ha, your son has great taste imo; I love Grimes especially.

I enjoyed Eugenides “Middlesex” especially, but “The Virgin Suicides” is very engaging, as well. “Middlesex”, though epic” is more optimistic than the earlier book. I’ll have to read the new one.

February 3rd, 2013 at 8:52 pm

Thanks for that article Giles, grandfather Nadal was a musician/conductor who knew eh? if my late father were still alive,i would be asking him all about Rafas grandad,as he was a massive fan of classical music,and all the greats that Grendel mentioned.

February 4th, 2013 at 4:48 am

Check out this video on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oUcaaSIKUI&feature=youtube_gdata_player
alison. Here is a video of Rafa’s grandpa conducting his last concert. Rafa was in attendance, obviously! Enjoy!

February 4th, 2013 at 8:05 am

Thankyou Giles that was truely beautiful,does this families talents know no bounds? Rafa wants to be a golfer when hes finished playing tennis,great hes thinking about his future later on in life,Rafa must be so proud of his grandfather and vice versa.

February 4th, 2013 at 8:45 am

nadal is losing his hair doping

February 4th, 2013 at 9:10 am

alison. Glad you enjoyed the video, so did I. Rafa is already a good golfer and has won a tourney this year!!

February 4th, 2013 at 10:46 am