Dimitrov, Zverev, Estrella Burgos ATP Weekend Winners
by Staff | February 13th, 2017, 11:02 am
  • 120 Comments

Zverev Sweeps Singles, Doubles at ATP Montpellier


German teen Alexander Zverev won his second career singles title on Sunday, in the final of the Open Sud de France in Montpellier upsetting homecountry favorite Richard Gasquet 7-6(4), 6-3.

In the doubles he partnered with his older brother Mischa, in the final upsetting No. 2 seeds Fabrice Martin and Daniel Nestor.

“It’s great to win singles and doubles,” the younger Zverev said. “I’m very happy the way we played. We only dropped one set in the tournament. I think it was a very successful tournament for the Zverevs.”

It was the first ATP doubles title for the younger Zverev, who was the first player to win singles and doubles at the same tournament since Lleyton Hewitt at Newport in 2014, and part of the first brothers pair to win a title since Andy and Jaime Murray in Tokyo in 2011.

The 19-year-old won his first singles title last year at St. Petersburg, Russia. The 30-year-old Gasquet was the two-time defending champ in  Montpellier looking for a fourth overall title, but ended up falling to 14-14 in career finals.

Dimitrov Raises Trophy on Home Soil at Garanti Koza Sofia Open

Grigor Dimitrov won his first title on home soil in Bulargia on Sunday, defeating David Goffin 7-5, 6-4 in the final of the Garanti Koza Sofia Open amidst a career resurgence.

“This is my most prestigious title for sure, winning it at home is a tremendous success for me,” said the 25-year-old who is closing on a Top 10 ranking. “I will treasure this title for the rest of my life, it’s something amazing for me.”

It was his second 2017 title following Brisbane.

In both sets Dimitrov jumped out to a 3-0 lead before fighting off the Belgian to close it out. In the second set he lead 5-0 before double fault yips helped bring the match to 5-4, but on the fourth match point Dimitrov crossed the finish line.

“David is an extremely good player, I just had to focus and just be there in each point and each game,” Dimitrov said. “He’s one of the toughest competitors out there. I was 5-1 up and 40-0 up and I still couldn’t close it out. The way he played at the end was incredible.”

Goffin fell to 2-5 in career finals, and was looking to raise a trophy for the first time since 2014.

Ecuador Stays Magical for Estrella Burgos

Victor Estrella Burgos has now won three career titles at the Ecuador Open in Quito — and has never won a title anywhere else.

On Sunday he defended his Quito crown, saving a match point against No. 3 seed Paolo Lorenzi 6-7(2), 7-5, 7-6(6) to win the final.

“The recipe for my success here will be revealed when I retire,” said the champion with a laugh. “But for sure I’ll come back here next year. I’ll play in Quito every year until I retire.”

In the second round Estrella Burgos also saved match points, three against top seed Ivo Karlovic in a third-set tiebreak.

Estrella Burgos is 15-0 in Quito, and becomes the only player in tour history to win three titles at only one event.

Lorenzi fell to 1-2 in career finals. “I love playing here and I am sure I’ll be back next year,” he said. “I loved the crowd here and how they welcomed and supported me during the whole week. I am thankful. I’m leaving with an ATP final and that’s very important for me.”

 


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120 Comments for Dimitrov, Zverev, Estrella Burgos ATP Weekend Winners

SG1 Says:

“Estrella Burgos is 15-0 in Quito, and becomes the only player in tour history to win three titles at only one event.”

Kind of cool when you think about it. He is fortunate that the likes of Federer, Nadal, Djokovic,Murray, Wawrinka et al generally don’t show up in Ecuador but hey…you have to give the guy his props for beating who’s in front of him every time. 3 ATP titles for a journeyman player is not a bad haul. And maybe he wins a couple of more along the way.


skeezer Says:

SG1
Agreed, pretty cool. Looks like Zverev and Dimi are keeping the mojo going also, good to see.


SG1 Says:

Skeezer,

You have to think that this is the year for Dimitrov. He looks ready to take the next step and become a threat to beat the big guys. I think the question is, “Can he beat the Big Four or Five, 3 out of 5?”


skeezer Says:

“Can he beat the Big Four or Five, 3 out of 5?”
That what he needs to prove, no? Both these guys are fun to watch, will be watching more of them this year for sure…


Tennis Vagabond Says:

These were two of the very rare significant small tourney results.

Rog and Rafa came out of Oz as two that will be more relevant to watch in 2017 than we expected. I think for most of us, those two moved from top-tenners to Big Four co-tenants (if still the 2nd tier there).

Dmitrov and Zverev were the more surprising one – one was in the ranks of Great Prospect, the other was solidly in the ranks of Failed Prospects. They both had momentum coming into Oz, and they both showed that maybe, their time was now. But one tournament is just one tournament, especially query Australia (ask Dolgopolov).

We’ve all been waiting to see what Rog and Rafa can do in March and April, and these two kind of snuck under the radar with these tournament wins. Small tournaments can’t just be thrown away. It lets them learn, under easier conditions, to be champions. It shows they can regularly beat down those they need to beat down – which is an extremely difficult prerequisite to making the Slam quarters and semis. They also did it beating Gasquet and Goffin, two very strong players who have also been at the top of their own games for the past while.

Big wins. Auger great things.

Skeeze and SG1, I wouldn’t bet that these two will beat the Big Four when it counts, but I certainly want to see the match!


Amit Says:

Roger dethroned Pete, Rafa dethroned Roger, Djokovic dethroned Rafa, and the vicious cycle shall continue here and The One to dethrone Djokovic will be “The Dimitrov”…


Amit Says:

I firmly believe and would probably even bet that Dimitrov is the guy who usurps a grand slam this year… And so far as the CAN he beat the big-4 thing goes, the answer is YES for now.. But shall he be able to win 3 matches in a row beating the big-4 or Stanislas, then also the answer is a firm YES… Nobody thought Rafa could dominate Fed, but he did.. Nobody saw the once-inconsequent Djokovic dominate Nadal, but he did so MONUMENTALLY… None could ever foresee FO 08/WIM 08/AO 12 coming, but it did… Similarly , as impossible as it may seem right now, but Dimitrov will conquer them all, the big-5 may join forces, but will still fail to stop the Dimi Express!!! Be it Roger/Rafa/Djokovic, all were underdogs once, but we all know what they did next!!! Right Noe Dimitrov is in their stage, and he shall repeat their history through his racquet!!!


Amit Says:

Dimitrov vs Nadal AO 2017 SF is the watershed moment of tennis history!!! I just saw the birth of a new champion in that match!!! The one who shall usurp The Djokovic Empire…


Amit Says:

From the very beginning I knew that Grigor Dimitrov had sublime talent, a la-Safin… His natural flair and talent is too Pete-esque,Federer-esque, but most closely and prominently visible ‘Safin-Esque”… But what I saw in his semifinal WAR with Nadal in AO 17 is that now Dimitrov has the belief, the grit, the spirit, the confidence and even consistency!! The next time he meets Rafa in a slam, he shall have good chance of subduing him, and he most probably will, indeed.. Same can be said with respect to Federer, when he meets him in a coming Slam.. Against the naturally gifted but stubbornly defensive I minded Murray, Grigor will stand a GREAT chance in any slam as Murray is his own biggest rival, though he has so much talent and is truly capable of aggressive tennis, what he keeps doing mostly is playing defensive!! Good luck to Murray if he does the same mistake of not resorting to aggression when he meets Grigor in the next slam meeting!!! So finally, the most difficult one to beat for Grigor will be the current Darth Djokovic!! But then again, nobody imagined once that Djok will joke with Rafa at RG and straight-set him in Phillipe Chatrier, but he did; and none thought either that Novak outlasting Nadal in AO 12 championship match was possible, but we all know it’s history.. So if anything is to be learnt from history, then that is never think anything is impossible, certainly not in tennis!!! So don’t be surprised if the now underdog Dimitrov does what the then-underdog Djokovic did and beats everyone of the top-5 enroute even, if need be, to fulfill his burning desire of holding a Grand Slam!!!


Giles Says:

^^^ Nah! He still needs some more balls! Lol


Wog Boy Says:

Amit,
I like Griša, is he going to beat Nole..yes, is he going to beat Rafa…yes, is he going to beat Andy…yes, but hard, is he going to beat Roger…never, or to be more precise, never in the matches that matters to Roger. Try to guess the reasons? Can he go through two of above mentioned… hard…through three…no, not to mention Stan, Nishikori, Raonic, Zverev, Thiem and so on.
Is Griša going to win GS, I wish but I doubt it, all we can do is to wait and see.
Yes, match against Rafa was one his best performances, probably the best, yet he fell short against Rafa, not at his best Rafa, that is telling.


Wog Boy Says:

One more thing, I wouldn’t compare him with Safin, Safin was a beast, arguably the most talented beast, his BH was next none, he just didn’t care to much about tennis, he wasn’t quite switched on for tennis.


AndyMira Says:

I don’t think Dimi is ready to win a slam yet…Sure,he’s hot atm..but to win a slam,you need to be consistent for 2 whole weeks,where there could possibly be 2,3,4 or 5 five setter along the way…First of all,he has to reach a final first which he hasn’t done it yet..and i will start believing he’s a slam candidate if he’s to reach another semi’s,let’s say in Wimbledon or USO..then we will talk about him can win a slam…Just because Andy and Novak lost early at AO that doesn’t mean they’re not the biggest threat anymore…They’re still are…They’re not no 1 and 2 for nothing..and Roger and rafa also will still be there…can Dimi passed these guys for a slam…i don’t think so!He needs to show the consistency and his mental strength first..then we’ll talk about him winning a slam…


Okiegal Says:

@AM…….Good comment and I agree with you 100%……


AndyMira Says:

@Okie….He he..Thank u ma’am!!


Okiegal Says:

@AM……UR w e l c o m e………


Amit Says:

Well @Wogboy and @AndyMira don’t disagree with you guys that Dimitrov has much to prove, but from what I saw : He Has It… … To take it to the biggies, even consecutively. I personally don’t think that this is the highest level of Grigor.. He is still learning .. BUT he showed what he can do.. Whether Rafa was 100% or not, doesn’t matter.. Of course Rafa wasn’t.. But who am I to say, personally, that Dimitrov was playing at his best level!! And who’s to say that there’s a guarantee that Murray/Djokovic will be at their best, if/when any if them faces Grigor the next time in s spam!! And Stanislas is certainly not an insurmountable obstacle in any way,for anyone!! Stanislas may have as many slams as Murray, but he is still far behind Murray in my eyes, let alone Djokovic/Rafa/King Fed!!! And for sure neither Murray nor Djokovic are gonna get any better from here onwards!! There’s some advantage after all in being 4-5 years younger to a player, and Dimitrov will benefit from it!! Its time bound rule of nature!! Moreover no great faced another great at their respective peaks, especially when there’s a 4-5 years age difference!! The sampras who lost to Federer in Win 01 was not at his best, nor was the Federer at his best, even though the match ended in Fed’s favour!!! The crushing losses of Djokovic are inevitable signs of his decline, and unfortunately Murray never decided/tried reaching the apex in the first instance!!! Murray in my eyes, is a huge under-achiever, considering how many tough losses he endured to big-4, particularly considering the manner he suffered them!! And honestly, if estomin/mischa can beat Djokovic/Murray, why not the far more talented Dimitrov can do that!! In my eyes, he can and he will!! Remember the FO 09 semi between Fer and JMDP?? Or the USO 09 semi between Rafa/JMDP?? Or the AO 13 semi between Wawrinka and Djokovic??? It was harbinger of the glory that lied ahead of JMDP/Wawrinka!! I feel similar regarding the AO 17 semi between Rafa and Dimitrov!! Particularly when you look at how talented Grigor is, nothing is out of his reach if/when he decides, except probably surpassing the mighty Roger Federer in terms of tennis greatness/genius!!


Amit Says:

BTW wogboy and Andymira, who are your favorite tennis players?? Mine is Federer.. :p


Amit Says:

Giles: Dimitrov didn’t beat Rafa in AO 17 doesn’t mean he doesn’t have balls, he coulda beaten Rafa with the slightest bit of luck/experience!! Grigor showed enough heart in that match, even Rafael Nadal The Great knows it!! Ask him if you can, regarding this!! Losing to Rafa is possible, even if you’re playing bravely!! It happens and has happened in tennis!! Rosol/Darcis/Brown beat Rafa in fluke performances at Wimby doesn’t meaan they have bigger balls than Rafa!!


AndyMira Says:

@Amit…I already congratulate ALL Rog fans here for his incredible 18th AO win but i will do it again personally for u…So,congrats again Amit…it must be awesome to see your fav winnning again after so long…i will jump to the moon and back if Rafa win!..That means Rafa is my fav Amit…

About Dimi…yeah..he has the tool the be a slam winner Amit…it’s just,i think he needs more time to be up there more consistently with other greats..get used to the high level of play and the pressure and the mental toughness that was required to be a slam winner…it needs a lot when you’re in the final,not just your game …I certainly will watch Dimi closely this year Amit…if he can reach semi’s or final for the rest of the 3 slams and then i will tip him to win a slam more than Milos…


Wog Boy Says:

Amit,

My favorite was carnivore this is Sparta Nole, not vegan treehugger Nole, so technically I don’t have a favorite atm though I like Thiem, but God, that man needs to reorganize himself and find a new coach.
I don’t pick favorites just because they are best in what they are doing, never worked for me, there is more in personality and body language that draws me to player (or person), sorry but Roger never had any of that for me, even he is best in business or more precisely, has the best records in business.
You can see what kind of players I liked: Nastase, Connors, Agassi, Safin, Nalbandian, Rafa, Delpo, Nole…Thiem, just few of them:)

BTW, what is your background?


Wog Boy Says:

^^^
I missed Gustavo Kuerten, not so much because of his tennis, but because he was truly good, bighearted, generous person, just the bloke you would always love to have as a friend, he looks like somebody who has healing power and radiates the same.


skeezer Says:

Sparta ____?
Sparta Fed! Just watch AO 17 baby!


Wog Boy Says:

“Sparta Fed! Just watch AO 17 baby!”

Against WTA serve, outdated game plan, most preferred court speed and bounce, 80% Rafa capabilities and yet you needed five sets, sure…shame, it should be done and dusted in three quick sets…Sparta lmao..FO dude😹.


Wog Boy Says:

“Concentrate on FO”…😇


Amit Says:

@AndyMira Rafael Nadal is a class player, I think he is untouchable to anyone amongst the current players on glay, and second only foto Roger on Grass.. Its on hard courts and indoor, however, that Nole scores better!!


AndyMira Says:

@Amit…Agree with u!!


Amit Says:

Wogvoy, I like Kuerten a lot, as well, a class guy off court, and also on it!! Superb prowess on clay, and IMHO better than both Roger/Djokovic on clay.. I didn’t like Rafa beforehand due to my Federer-bias, but of late has become a fan-kind of him… And Djokovic, I loved him once, when he used to deny Rafa the Slam wins, but didn’t like him stopping Roger, LOL!! :p Funnily enough, you see, Federer , Nadal and Djokovic have harmed each other a lot, as each have denied the others, vital slam wins, lolzzz :p Rafa has prevented Fed from winning 6 slams, Few has denied Rafa three slams!! Novak has denied Rafa at least three slams, and Rafa too has stopped Novak from getting victorious at 3 slams!! Federer has snatched a GS from Novak, and Novak has beaten Fed in two slam finals!! Lots of damage done to each other in slam finals, LOLzzz!!! Funny!!!


Amit Says:

*Fed and not Few has denied Rafa three slam wins I mean…


Amit Says:

Murray has harmed Novak in two slam finals, while Djokovic has harmed him a lot at AO and FO!!!


Amit Says:

Thus, we can conclude that Fed, Rafa and Novak have kept things interesting, by beating each other in slam finals, lolzzz ;p


Amit Says:

More funnily, Stan has denied Novak two slams lol ;p


Amit Says:

Wogboy, the way Rafa was playing, nobody could have beaten him easily in AO 17.. And I do think Federer is the ultimate Spartan in tennis.. He never gives up easily to anyone.. More often than not, its pretty damn tough to beat Fed… By the way, am a lawyer and from India, but an avid tennis fan…


Amit Says:

Murray and Novak are 2-5 in slam finals, right??


Amit Says:

Alexander Xverev is being spoken of very highly, of late… The guy has some potential I guess too..


Amit Says:

By the way, Fed has also lost his speed, but still he shows he can win slams.. And much needed correction: Novak has denied Roger 3 slams I think… Fed forehand has lost its previous glory though.. Not to mention, he is far more mentally fragile than he used to be.. Still he almost beats Novak and Rafa.. That again being 5-6 years older than these two.. He deserves credit indeed…


Amit Says:

NOT FOR NOTHING, Federer is The Greatest Ever Tennis Player!!! :D


Amit Says:

Nice article indeed AndyMira. But I don’t hold high hopes for Milos. Don’t find his game good enough for slam wins..


Wog Boy Says:

Amit,
Thanks for reply, one correction though, Nole is 3:1 in GS finals against Roger and 9:6 in GS matches, only one that has beaten Roger in all four GS and vice versa, Roger doesn’t have positive score in any of GS against Nole, Nole has positive score against Roger in AO and Wimbledon, not bad considering we are talking about “The Greatest Ever Tennis Player!”
As for Rafa, we agree to disagree, he was nowhere near his best, Dimitrov should’ve beaten him.


Wog Boy Says:

One more thing, you do sound familiar to me, something like deja vu, but that’s only me.


AndyMira Says:

@Amit…At first,i think so too…BUT,take a look at Stan..he won his 1st slam at the age of 29?…and Milos sure still has much time left on his side to improve his game,mental fortitude and maybe work out a little bit more on his diet or training regimen in order to avoid injuries…after all,he’s already much closer than other’s to win a slam IMO…he’s already reached a final at Wimby last year and he’s also consistent in his ranking these last couple of years..that means he’s consistent with his perfomance even though he’s got injury here and there..

It’s very interesting to see from 3 of them,who will get a first slam although i’m not hoping much on Kei…you know,due to his fitness and stamina…


Amit Says:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oVIXUST6zRM LOOK AT THAT!!! Nadal vs Dimitrov in AO 14!! The last slam between the two was a four set win for Rafa.. This AO 17 was a 5 set cliffhanger with Nadal victorious!! Grigor is closing in the gap and I can safely say that defeating Rafa isn’t far from him, Grigor will certainly win their next match in slam!! He has already straight-setted Murray in Wimbledon 14!! And Federer is surely gonna lose to Dimitrov sooner than later IMHO!! And its not like Dimitrov has never beaten Novak either, he has!! Moreover the talent plus the between-the-legs shot of this clip just confirmed to me that its within a year that Grigor will win a slam!! Glad I found someone to root for post Federer retirement!! And Dimitrov will not win just one slam, he shall win many!! #GutFeeling #HeartSpeaks


Amit Says:

Wogboy: I acknowledged by correction in previous post already regarding Fed-Novak 1:3 slam final record saying Novak has denied 3 slams to Fed instead of two, which I wrongfully said in my previous post!! And moreover eerily familiar/similar people are not rare, even though they are different completely!!! Yeah, Fed doesn’t lead Novak anywhere in slams because Novak has not been in many slam finals between 2007-11, whereas Roger has reached many slam finals from 2011-17!!!


Amit Says:

Novak, as great as he is, someone is still greater, The Greatest, in fact…


Amit Says:

Wogboy Fed too was playing through injury and is 35.. He too isn’t the Federer of old, in fact far from his peak.. As is Nadal, so evens out… He is a content man..


Amit Says:

AndyMira, Thank You So Much!!! For congratulating me!! Fed and Rafa are the best, and their rivalry is legendary and my FAVOURITE!!! :) Nothing matches Fedal!!! ✋✋✋


AndyMira Says:

@Amit…Ha ha ha…You’re most welcome!!btw Amit…you should meet with Okie and J.S[The Most HARDCORE rafafans on TX!]…those 2 are so CRAZY CRAZY about FEDAL rivalries like u do!!he he…


Amit Says:

Thanks AndyMira :D Ok, bring them on!! #FEDALforever💃💃💃👼👼👼


Amit Says:

Novak’s aggression I really admire.. Hope Murray learns something from watching some of Novak’s matches as to how and when to hit a superb forehand. Will do him a world of good.


Chrisford1 Says:

Amit – “Rafael Nadal is a class player, I think he is untouchable to anyone amongst the current players on glay, and second only foto Roger on Grass.. Its on hard courts and indoor, however, that Nole scores better!!”

1. Rafa is a class player.
2. He was virtually untouchable on clay to all but one current player. The only player Uncle Toni admitted he feared could beat Rafa on dirt since 2009.
3. Not sure about Nadal being 2nd best to Federer on grass. He has two big wins on grass. Djokovic and Murray have 3.
4. More than Slams matter. Andy’s two golds. Novak surpassing Rafa and Fed in Masters 1000 titles. The H2H Rafa has over all players except Davydenko until Djokovic finally leveled and surpassed Nadal in 2016.


kjb Says:

Dustin Brown and Borna Coric also have winning records over Nadal, No? as well as some retired players as well.


skeezer Says:

“More than Slams matter.”
This is what matters;
https://www.facebook.com/Federer/posts/10155021722784941:0


Amit Says:

Chrisford: How about many of Federer’s records where None con s even close in this generation… Like 302 weeks at #1, out of which four are consecutive year end #1 finishes.. Then 5 titles at least at 3 slams, 7 Wimbledon titles, 5 finals in his worst slam… And so far as beating Nadal on clay is concerned, Djokovic has done it at the greatest stage just once in 2015 RG.. Rafa had already been at the very top for 10 years,winning 9 RG enroute… Soderling had even beaten Rafa once at RG.. Djokovic did it once.. I shall wait to see him beating Rafa at RG again before declarihg Novak as the man who can actually compete with a truly in-form Rafa at RG.. And never ever can I not think that Nadal is the best grass courter of this era besides Fed.. Nadal has reached 3 consecutive Wimbledon finals and could not win all 3 only because there was the Federer of yore on the other side!! The Federer whom Djokovic beat in 2014 and 2015 was a pale shadow of the 04-07 Federer, its pretty much it..
So I respectfully disagree from you regardinf the superior grass-court credentials of Nadal.. And I am ok with Fed winning nothing except more slams for the rest of his career, I hardly mind any X or Y winning as many Masters Series titled as he can..


Amit Says:

Hahahahahahaha nice pic Skeezer, I love it!!!👼👼👼👑👑👑💰💰💰🎉🎇🎊✌✌✌👹👹👹


Chrisford1 Says:

kgp – H2H does not become meaningful until players have 5-7 matches, Simple rule of stats, you need a meaningful sample size. 1-2 against Coric and 0-2 against a 32 year old journeyman tennis player rarely in the Top 50 do not count.

amit – You dispute the idea that Fed was a great player who just so happened to play in a time 2002-2007, where the competition was weaker than what Murray, Rafa and Nole found 5 years after., so his stats were padded..
By bringing up padded records. 302 weeks as #1, 3 Slam titles at least 5 times, etc. all padded due to the weak era.
Like most Fed fans, you want to say Slamcount is everything, no weak era existed.
And on Nadal and Djokovic:
1. Djokovic is the only person who played on clay well enough to truly worry Rafa and Uncle Toni, as Uncle Toni said. Of course Novak is not as good as Rafa on clay – but good enough not just to worry the Nadal family, good enough to beat Rafa in the top 4 clay tournaments. (only guy to do it).
2. Rafa, if you count stuff other than Slams, has a big gap in his resume. The WTF, or just playing indoors, period.
3. Novak will live with 3 Olympics where he had great chances, even was the favorite – to fall anyways.


Chrisford1 Says:

In the end, if you look at stats, and look past just Slams:

Fed was likely 2nd on hardcourt, #1 on grass, 3rd to 5th on clay. Great indoors/
Andy was 3rd or 4th on hardourt, 2nd on grass, 5th to 7th on clay. Solid in playing indoors.
Novak was likely #1 as a hardcourt player, 3rd to 5th on grass, #2 on clay. Excellent indoors.
Rafa was was 3rd or 4th on hardcourt, 3rd to 5th on grass, #1 on clay anywhere he playe. And he truly sucked indoors.

Heathwise- avoiding illness and injury:
Fed was #1, Novak #2.

“Raw Tennis Talent” – Fed #1, Murray #2, Rafa #3, Novak #4
“Athleticism and mental strength” – Nadal, then Djokovic. Put Andy and Roger where you want after those two.


AndyMira Says:

CF1…”Raw tennis Talent”…Fed#1 Murray #2,Rafa #3,Novak #4..

Uncle Toni once said that Novak more talented than Rafa and i happened to agree with him…so,Novak should be #2 and Rafa #3 or #4,same with Andy #3 or #4..can’t make up my mind between those 2..


Markus Says:

CF1, it seems to me that you consider the time Federer was winning everything as a weak era because there was nobody like Federer there (although Federer continued to win majors long after Djokovic and Nadal won their first). And the time Nadal or Djokovic were number one, you consider as strong eras was because there was a Federer there. Take away Federer and you have a Djokovic with only an often injured Nadal to contend with. The common denominator in your strong and weak era theory is Federer. What does it say about a man who is the measuring stick in his field?


Tennisisthebest Says:

Markus, 👏👍🙏 so true! It all goes back to Federer; past, present, future; left, right, centre! Gosh! Take away the Federer measuring stick and there is no standard to talk about. Weak era was weak coz Federer was the first player who raised tennis to a whole different level. If Djokovic or Murray had been in that era, I don’t think they would have dominated like Federer did. They have developed into great champions only later and BECAUSE of Federer’s lofty standards. They would not have become the players they are without Federer. Djokovic and Murray, talented as they are, struggled for years to break Fedal monopoly although they have always been a good challenge. Through those struggles, they have become monster players. Federer is the pioneer of the ridiculous standards of today. He started the lofty standards; he “built” the monster champions of today. He is the measuring stick. No matter how you twist it, Chrisford, it all comes back to Federer.


Amit Says:

Chrisford: Weak era has started post 2010, when Fed and Rafa declined, Fed crossed 30, Rafa too started burning out after staying 6 years at the top.. That is what Djokovic took advantage of and won a few, as there was only the headcase Murray to contend with. And BTW 2004-07 was so weak that Nadal could win nothing outside clay in terms of slam titles… You can console yourself that 2004-07 was weak era.. But truth is far.. Rather now men’s tennis is starting to look good again with emergence of few youngsters… Otherwise post 2010 is a totally weak era, moreso considering that even Rafael Nadal became shaky on clay after that rampaging 2005-08, during which he routed all and sundry on clay… Since 2010, Rafa has become so much vulnerable on clay, that it’s not even funny.. A guy who loses to journeyman like Istomin at arguably his peak, is hardly worth considering the mental giant that you think he is.. Sorry, but I don’t buy that Djokovic is mentally strong… Federer is peerless, Djokovic is good but nowhere near Federer… Beating an old Federer or a mental midget Murray or a declined Rafa and winning a few slams doesn’t mean suddenly people’ll be buying Djokovic is mentally stronger than Federer thing… As hard as people may try to be dismissive of Federer, there’s hardly anything where he is not supreme, he is the best in most aspects.. Only Rafa rivals his mental strength and fighting attitude… Djokovic comes after Federer and Rafa.. Just because Federer “Made It Look Easy”, doesn’t mean its easy to do what he did.. If it were so, nobody stopped Novak from winning slams before 2010.. Its not a coincidence that Djokovic couldn’t start his slam run until Federer and Nadal declined..


Amit Says:

There were quite a few grand slam holders from 2004-07, like Agassi, Safin, Hewitt, Roddick, Ferraro, Moya and Nadal himself.. That’s why strong players like Nadal couldn’t get a slam outside of clay in that 04-07 period as it was certainly not a cakewalk in slams then.. People can talk as much as they want to, but that doesn’t make The Djokovic Era the strongest era ever, lol..


Amit Says:

And let’s not even go further back to 2002 or we will overlap with Sampras era.. Lol


Amit Says:

Having guys like Agassi, Safin, Hewitt, Roddick, Ferrero, Kuerten, Gaudio, Moya and Nadal makes 2004-07 a much better era than the Djokovic era..


Chrisford1 Says:

Andy Mira – “CF1…”Raw tennis Talent”…Fed#1 Murray #2,Rafa #3,Novak #4..

Uncle Toni once said that Novak more talented than Rafa and i happened to agree with him…so,Novak should be #2 and Rafa #3 or #4″

Toni is infamous for always saying that the other guy is more talented and the favorite, and Rafa the underdog. The consensus of experts is Andy has more “raw tennis talent” than Nadal or Djokovic, but less than Fed.

————————————–
Amit – “Having guys like Agassi, Safin, Hewitt, Roddick, Ferrero, Kuerten, Gaudio, Moya and Nadal makes 2004-07 a much better era than the Djokovic era..”

Bwaaaah!!
Look who Fed faced in his 1st twelve Slam wins.
Look who Nadal faced, and Djokovic..

========


skeezer Says:

“Bwaaaah!!
Look who Fed faced in his 1st twelve Slam wins.
Look who Nadal faced, and Djokovic..”

This person is always changing the critera to suit his argument, lol. Fail.


AndyMira Says:

CF1…”The consensus of experts is Andy has more Raw Tennis Talent than nadal or Djokovic,but less than Fed”…

Oh!Really?….Than i’m OKAY with that too!!


Chrisford1 Says:

Since Gasquet is talked about as a talent equal to Feds, Andy Mira – obviously “tennis talent” aka “tennis genius” is a component of success that Rafa and Novak make up for in other attributes – speed. mental sttength, GIANT hearts, constant self-pressure to improve and develop what they were not born with.


DC Says:

If 2004-2007 was a weak era, its strage that Nadal could not stop any of the weak era people from beating him on hard courts. Nadal was the #2 from 2005-2008 and he didnt make a single HC Grand Slam final.

The weak era started after Feds decline in 2008. First it was Nadal to grab the opportunity. Onace Nadals decline started in 2011, it was Djokovics turn to take advantage.

The weak era has been going on since 2011. A 30 year old Fed beat Nole in the 2011 FO semi final, then a 31 year old Fed beat Nole in the Wibmy 12 semi final to eventually take the championship. And now a 35 year old coming from a 6 month break wins a grand slam.


AndyMira Says:

CF1..1:25am…Couldn’t agree more with u!!!


DC Says:

Also one should not forget why Einstein is great. He took advantage of the weak era of scientists.
And sure Apple sucks – they just took advantage of a weak era..who did they have to beat – blackberry


sinha71 Says:

“That’s why strong players like Nadal couldn’t get a slam outside of clay in that 04-07 period”

“If 2004-2007 was a weak era, its strage that Nadal could not stop any of the weak era people from beating him on hard courts. Nadal was the #2 from 2005-2008 and he didnt make a single HC Grand Slam final.”

LOL, a period of time when “prime” Roger was No. 1 and Rafa was a firm No. 2 just 17-20 years old against a field of pretenders.

Cherry pick your facts much?


sinha71 Says:

How many players are making multiple slam finals younger than 21 besides Rafa and Nole in the last 25 years LOL???

You give him too much credit at such a tender age.


Amit Says:

Chrisford: I already told u who Federer faced for his 1st twelve grand slams.. Djokovic faced an old declined Federer and a burnt out Nadal, plus only Murray was the only serious challenge thought of for Djokovic to contend with… Lol Djokovic didn’t have to even face JMDP as JMDP remained injured for most part of Djokovic era, Federer and Nadal are the ones who faced JMDP.. Novak is so strong mentally that he loses to underdog like Wawrinka in consecutive slam finals. God knows what Federer would have handed him at his prime!! Or even Nadal!! Djokovic actually faced pretty little competition that can be called healthy or potentially fatal.. Not his problem he made hay in era of Federer and Nadal’s decline… 👹👹👹


Amit Says:

Nadal had already started winning slams by 19… Nadal peaked at earlier age than Fed.. He was always there… And his decline started at 24.. Its not so difficult to understand…


Tennis Vagabond Says:

…checks in…

weak era argument…. same people… same exact thread… same arguments in same order…

….checks out…


sinha71 Says:

No it’s easy to understand how a guy started winning slams during that time, beating Fed on clay and hard court so young before his prime LOL.

Just ask cf1.


Amit Says:

Glad u understood sinha that Rafa could easily beat Fed even on hardcourts then whereas he keeps losing to any tom,dick and harry these days, even on clay, from 2011 onwards.. LOLzzz again.. 😹😹😹


sinha71 Says:

I do understand. He was mentally strong then and hasn’t been since 2013.

Its not so difficult to understand.


Amit Says:

Exactly sinha!!! Now chill…


Amit Says:

And 2 mins silence for weak era theorists.. 🙏🙏🙏


Amit Says:

Anyway,I am outta this weak era argument… Better things to talk about which exist for real, instead of fiction analysis.. Say whatever you have to say regarding Federer’s competition.. When is Dubai tournament starting by the way???


Chrisford1 Says:

DC – “The weak era started after Feds decline in 2008. First it was Nadal to grab the opportunity. Onace Nadals decline started in 2011, it was Djokovics turn to take advantage.

The weak era has been going on since 2011. A 30 year old Fed beat Nole in the 2011 FO semi final, then a 31 year old Fed beat Nole in the Wibmy 12 semi final to eventually take the championship.”

1. 2008 was simply the competition arriving, DC. Not Feds sudden decline at 26.
2. Signs ere already there in 2006 that Nadal would be no simple Spanish clay court specialist. Djokovic and to some extent Andy a year later. Then in 2008, all three were taking titles from Roger on all surfaces. The other guys won 3 of the Slams, the gold medal, 7 of the 9 Masters, and Djokovic won the ATP WTF. Fed got the USO after Andy fortunately for Roger, disposed of Rafa in the semis..
3. Fed fans hate the argument that weak era in no way means people are saying Fed is anything less than a great player. They set up that strawman every time. He is a great player able to beat his peers now and then 2008 and on. It’s just that his records are padded.


sinha71 Says:

cf1 exactly. Especially the last point.


AndyMira Says:

@Amit..It will start on 27th…btw..why u didn’t come here sooner Amit?TX could use a more lively and friendly personality like u…Hey guess what??I like u already!!he he..


Chrisford1 Says:

Tennis Vagabond Says:

…checks in…

weak era argument…. same people… same exact thread… same arguments in same order…

——————

It’s simply because people keep claiming Slamcount and Roger being tops in that is the only thing that matters. Saying dumb stuff like “He’s got 18 of the only titles that matter. He’s GOAT and all debate is over!!”
And others effectively rebut that and enrage Fed fans by pointing out the quality of competition was different over Federer’s career.


Chrisford1 Says:

Amit – “Lol Djokovic didn’t have to even face JMDP as JMDP remained injured for most part of Djokovic era, Federer and Nadal are the ones who faced JMDP”.

————

That would surprise both guys, Amit, as they faced off many times.
Djokovic is 11-4 on Delpo. Both have lost big matches to the other, but Djokovic is overall the better player. You must not remember the two Olympic wins of Delpo over Nole, or Djokovic taking him down in the USO and in the 2013 Wimbledon semifinal thriller.


Amit Says:

I am sorry Chrisford, but keep me out of the fanciful weak era argument.. Something else to say?? I am not into knocking down any great player.. So don’t discuss unnecessary things like weak era or whatever you think.. Never heard anyone knowledgeable or tennis legend talking of 2004-07 as weak.. And none is enraged about anything.. WeFederer fans really don’t care what others say, coz FEDERER IS THE GREATEST EVER TENNIS PLAYER..


Markus Says:

Del Potro was just getting in the groove when he started having injury problems. Had he not been injured, Djokovic would most definitely not have accumulated most of his majors due to lack of any real competition. As Amit said, Federer was on the decline due to age and Nadal due to injuries. The rest of the players are so weak that they could not even beat the declining Roger and Rafa. That is how weak the era of Djokovic domination is.


Amit Says:

Calling someone as GOAT based on slam counts is quite rational… Its the most concrete criteria for determining the GOAT. And besides things like weeks at #1, WTF title count, MS count, overall title count, best-win loss ratio in a successful year of any player, longevity, consistency at various tournaments are the only things worthy in anointing somebody as greater than the rest. Except the MS count, where Roger ain’t much behind anyone either, in teems of the rest of the criterias, none comes even close to Fed!! BS is is when you put forth a worthless weak era argument, to counter all this.. Good Luck anyway trying… Only thing left to do with critics w.r.t Federer now, to console themselves. Fed fans hardly mind the noise. 😎😎😎


Amit Says:

Show me what your guy has got more in comparison to Federer, and it must not be abstract stuff, but concrete, then only I may care as a Fed fan to respond… No amount of mud-slinging at Federer’s credibility will work now..


Amit Says:

Novak was Federer’s fave whipping boy at GS until 2012.. ThNk God Fed aged and started having the inevitable mental lapses as well as lack of youthful hunger for success, of which Djokovic started taking advantage towards 2010.. Or else Djokovic would find nowhere to save himself from morale-sapping losses.. And Nadal’s physical style too took its toll on Rafa and his burn-out started towards 2010 end itself, this as he was the apex predator besides Fed from 2005-10, the whole time during which each thrashed Djokovic at will in slams as well as in most of the other tournaments.. It has gotten to the point of boredom, to be honest… Glad circumstance shaped up for Djokovic to avenge his losses or else it was becoming mayhem for him at Fedal hands.. So may be that helps stop Djokovic fans from over-thinking and confusion…


Ahfi Says:

I keep getting amused by this weak era argument about Federer’s earlier wins. I guess that era was so weak that Nadal plus some others were also able to win some slams, right? Guess what, if it was that weak, Federer then should have won all 4 slams every year for about 4 years? In 5 years, he would have gotten 20.

If Federer era was week era, what about the past two to three years of Djokovic where the only real competitor he had in finals was the tired and aging Federer??? There was nobody else to challenge him. Everybody was either injured or not trained enough. Are you still there?

Please do NOT bother to attack me because I just make my point and move on. I do not come back to read your nonsense. Ciao.


Amit Says:

Markus: YOU NAILED IT
.. Federer indeed is the yardstick of tennis greatness.. 😎😎😎


sinha71 Says:

Unlike virtually any other era, Federer had no consistent opponent in slam finals prior to 2008 (clay excepted). I guess that they were all equally exceptional LOL!

Speaks volumes.


DC Says:

Soon Nole will overtake Nadal in terms of Grand Slams won.
He’s been ranked no 1 for longer than Nadal.

Nole is the only active player who can challenge feds accomplishment. let’s see how that goes , till then Feds the goat


lakie Says:

Poor Djok has gone out of the GOAT conversation!


Amit Says:

sinha: you must have started watching tennis post 2007 I guess. Otherwise you’d know there was a certain Nadal from 2006-08 in Wimbledon finals and roddick in various other places.. And if it weren’t for Nalbandian, Federer would have crossed 20.. And for your information: Hewitt and Nalbabdian used to have upper hand in their rivalry with Fed, just like Rafa and Fed used to have upper hand over Novak.. In both cases, the champs turned it around and went from losing consistently to winning consistently.. Enthusiasm/rhetoric isn’t enough, little bit credible information is required for discussion, and not just abstractions and imagination, which have no reality in them… Its awfully easy to forget how Federer used to struggle against his peers Hewitt/Nalbandian and used to lose them in a row, be it in slams or outside.. That’s the art of cherry-picking of some.. Short memory/little information plus bias are antithetical to logical argument… Must be tough for some, lolzzz


Amit Says:

Anyway those rivals of Federer were slam winners, so obviously exceptional.. Since when have ordinary people winning slams, lolzz


Margot Says:

@ TV 20/02
Checks in……
Checks out.


sinha71 Says:

Sorry to disappoint Amit but I started watching in the 70′s.

We are talking BEFORE 2008 and as I said other than clay.

So as I said NO consistent slam finalists during that period unlike any other point in time in the Open Era.

Please stop the fake news try as you might. Besides Amit, didn’t you ask to be kept out of this debate just yesterday LOL?


Amit Says:

Yup Sinha, I am out of debate.. But I love players like Safin and Hewitt as much as you love the recent guys.. Oh so you are pretty old.. Hmmm.. Its sad you lack objectivity/experience despite much maturity and all you rest on is fiction, imagination and conjecture.. And even you got a pretty bad memory.. That’s your problem though.. Good luck..


Amit Says:

Sinha, stop copying me.. And a line for you: tum itna Jo muskura rahe ho, kya gham hai jisko chhupa rate ho.. 😛😛😛😹😹😹


Amit Says:

*rahe and not rate 😜


sinha71 Says:

One time finalists vs Fed include Philippoussis, Safin, Agassi (in his retirement year),Baghdatis and Gonzalez and teen-aged Djoko. A teen-aged Nadal made the rest of the field look as bad as Fed did in his prime.

For the record, I am not saying that Fed isn’t the best of all time – he has just as much credibility to that claim as any other great.

However, either way, it wouldn’t be justified by the slam differential alone. It would have to be more than that because of the period in question.


sinha71 Says:

Amit, you are self-projecting at 9:20 along with fake news?

So much of that going around the world lately.

But you are out of the debate of course LOL.


skeezer Says:

Checks in…
No debate here. Fed is still GOAT.
Checks out….


Van Persie Says:

Checks in
Made sure, that Skeezer is still alive.
Checks out.


Wog Boy Says:

VP,
Good to see you around, btw, he is suffering from the new age illness, FoMO, they are yet to find a cure on that one, so we should go easy on him;)


sinha71 Says:

WB, he’s like Rocky III.

Lost his ‘eye of the tiger’ to quote a dreadful song.

He has no Clubber Lang to piss him off.


Amit Says:

The only thing that’s fake us the criteria of you Sinha Babu.. 😝😝😝


Amit Says:

Yup but you can keep on dishing out your truthless pointless fictional theories here.. Nobody’s stopping you anyway.. Carry on.. ;p


Amit Says:

Sinha carry on.. Your funny phony posts add to drama here… Good job.. 😜


Wog Boy Says:

sinha71,

:)

Amit,

You said you are a solicitor, let’s pretend I believe you, I would never hire you to represent me in court, because mate, I have no doubt in my mind that if the crime I committed carries up to 10 years jail sentence, I’ll end up with 20 years if you are to represent me. Don’t get desperate though, you can be ok suburban solicitor for making the wills for elderly people and even some real estate transactions, not complicated ones.


sinha71 Says:

Checks in…

Amit still in the debate even though Amit Says: Yup Sinha, I am out of debate

Checks out…


skeezer Says:

Checks in…
?? No need, the Church is here, why?
18.
Checks out…


Van Persie Says:

Hi WB,

I was in Holiday for 2 weeks and took also a break from TX.

Hehe, you are oficially the discoverer of a new disease : “FOmofobia” :)


Amit Says:

Wogboy: Keep being pretentious.. Your pretentions and assumptions hardly matter to me and my purse… Good Luck…


Amit Says:

Sinha: Focus on yourself and not me… Enjoy yourself!!


Truth Says:

Amit. Poor dude. It’s ok. You can dream while everyone else actually watched real weak era players that couldn’t wait ti lose to Fraud.

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