My oh My.

What would BadBackRules say?

Ting!

December 3rd, 2013 at 11:12 am

fedfan Says:

“Sometimes, I could hardly move properly, and yet was sharply criticized by some people,” he added pointing out that such criticism was “unjustified.”

Yes, it was unjustified after all he has accomplished. I couldn’t agree more. Reminds me of many articles and comments I read including T-X after losses at Wimby and the two clay losses in July when fedfan struggled.

So much criticicm, second-guessing and calls from fans, bloggers and writers alike to change his game and/or retire.

Don’t listen to them fedfan. You still play amazing tennis!

Preach it, fedfan!

December 3rd, 2013 at 11:53 am

I wish I could forget to play tennis the way Roger did in 2013.

December 3rd, 2013 at 12:18 pm

Roger is ever the projecting optimist so it’s hard to tell what he’s really thinking or how he’s really feeling.

Even great players lose confidence. He has to take the wood to a couple of the top guys early in the year to get that confidence back. Winning is the only thing that generates confidence for elite athletes.

I do think that if Roger is healthy and confident that 5 wins may be possible. Maybe a M1000 is in the cards. Still can’t see him winning another slam though.

December 3rd, 2013 at 12:25 pm

It’s okay to dream. Nothing wrong with that.

Nightmare starts in Brisbane.

December 3rd, 2013 at 12:38 pm

Shut up Humble Rafa,
You never know of what is going to happen to Nadal ‘s damn knee again. Djokovic and Murray will somehow rip his knees off one day for sure. Nothing last forever especially the fragile knees unless he put the steel knees. Just wait and see.

December 3rd, 2013 at 1:01 pm

Hawkeye: Who is fedfan?
Oh and in reference to digging up Kipling (the poet not the cake) on a previous thread;
IF…….you can write something nice about Roger on each thread until at least Christmas….
IF……you could refrain from jumping into my conversations with the pleasant posters on here
IF…….you could concede that Federer has every right to live in Switzerland because erm….he’s Swiss and therefore is taxed accordingly
IF…….you could manage a raft of posts not involving veiled and sometimes not so veiled criticism of anyone not called Nadal
Then you’ll be a man my son.

December 3rd, 2013 at 1:47 pm

Purcell
Truth! ;)

And no worries, hawkeye at times gets confused with names, like fedfan, hawkeye,etc. I don’t know who she is talking about.

December 3rd, 2013 at 2:10 pm

Woot! Sounds good to me, Rog. Even if the titles don’t come, put up some more great displays and I’ll be satisfied.

December 3rd, 2013 at 2:17 pm

IF…….you could concede that Federer has every right to live in Switzerland because erm….he’s Swiss and therefore is taxed accordingly

Why dear Purcell, where did I say he didn’t have that right???

Bolm Kelvin, as for your hopes on Rafa’s knees, it is your only hope, no? I like your honesty My fan.

Vamos!

December 3rd, 2013 at 2:18 pm

IF……you could refrain from jumping into my conversations with the pleasant posters on here

Why dear Purcell, I don’t recall jumping into any conversation with you but, you are forgiven, I have many fans.

You’re welcome.

December 3rd, 2013 at 2:28 pm

The Grand Slams are for youngs, It has always been so. After 31, the possibilities to win a major are virtually nil. Only Rosewall(at the beggining of the Open era), Andres Gimeno(won Roland Garros with almost 35) and Andre Agassi(who had plenty of energy due to turbulent period in the 90s) are those who could do after that crucial age, and the American is the only to do so in the last 40 years. That talking about men.
Here is the info:
http://www.tennis28.com/slams/agerecords_winners.html

December 3rd, 2013 at 3:03 pm

It’s ok folks, fed is not setting his sights on winning any GS’s, he will just be happy winning 5 titles. I assume he means 5 250’s. Good luck fed.

December 3rd, 2013 at 3:40 pm

“fed is not setting his sights on winning any GS’s”.
Where is that link?
Besides, he already has 17. Fedfan not worried about those things.

December 3rd, 2013 at 4:22 pm

@Steve27 as has been pointed out before, agassi had sweet draws when he won his last two Australian opens at 31 and 32. If Fed could get draws similar to the ones agassi got he could win. Doubt that could happen unless the top 8 all went down with serious injuries.

December 3rd, 2013 at 8:26 pm

Put Rainer schuettler or arnaud Clement across the net from Fed and you could definitely chalk up vs #18

December 3rd, 2013 at 8:32 pm

Crazy human being blaming injuries for their loss..at least be original.

December 3rd, 2013 at 9:49 pm

We FEDFANS, don’t care what other people think or say about Roger. As long as he’s happy playing; we are happy. He’s still a horse that can run. Age is just a number, a cipher for the records. A man can’t retire his experience. He must use it. Experience achieves more with less energy and time.

December 3rd, 2013 at 10:20 pm

@ POGI: Spot on!!

Fans can’t ask for more if their fav is keen to play even at the twilight of his career. Wat really is inspiring and touching for all fedfans is that fed still is passionate abt his game….still believes that he cud bounce back and most importantly, he is every bit enjoying to be there at the centre of action….competing among the best.

And this is when….he has already achieved everything a tennis player dream of….not too many players (with fed’s achievements) wud hav thought to continue at this point, which we fans are proud of.

A lot of ppl get p!ssed off listening to fed’s never-say-die belief that he will bounce back, he will play even better (fighting off the age factor)….but that’s wat the quality & mark of a great player as fed is. I even dnt think rafa, nole or andy at their old days gonna say that “I knw I’m not gonna win this but I’m just playing here so that I dnt hav to sit at home doin nothin than to hear my wife yell at me..” ;)

Go Roger….we love u no matter wat….keep playing & keep spreading joys by making us watch u :))

December 3rd, 2013 at 10:40 pm

Nice to see Fed backers post on the site. It’s been infected with a vamos here, a vamos there, and very weak attempts at vamos everywhere.
Allez Fed no matter what!

December 4th, 2013 at 12:32 am

As simple as that. Roger lacks confidence and that adverse sentiment is reflected in his overall play. If you are not in your winning ways, you suddenly find you are in sea. Of late, Roger is struggling especially against the top three and even players like Berdych, Tsonga who Roger would beat 9 out 10 in his hey days are giving him lot of troubles where he is not able to match their pace on court and looks listless and outsmarted reconciling to the prospect of defeat. I am not sure how Roger is going to regain the rythm, speed and balance which are the hall mark of his game. But, according to me, he did play well both in Parrys Masters and WTF where I thought he was slowly getting back his lost rhythm. May be the fact that they are indoor courts worked to his advantage. But still Roger can take some confidence out of it and take it forward to 2014. I think the performance in 2014 would be crucial for Roger to decide whether he can move on. If 2014 turns to be as disastrous as 2013, then he certainly need to take call as to whether it is in his interest to continue in the professional circuit ?

December 4th, 2013 at 12:40 am

speed is impossible to diagnose accurately by standard observation. federer is only 32 and sprinters peak around 30. the idea he is significantly slower is not believable, especially since he has had no leg/foot/hip surgeries.

when you put anybody up against djoker they are likely to look ”slow”. even back in the day davydenko was faster than federer, hewitt was, coria was and so on. federer was quick but never the quickest. he was a mix of speed, power and precision.

if anybody has slowed it’s nadal. again, even this is hard to prove. but he does now seem to struggle at times and can even look lumbering. but nadal has compensated with superior technique, power and tactics compared to his younger days.

the truth about federer’s decline is similar to that of davydenko but a different order of magnitude. when you play a high risk aggressive game, confidence is a must and when you lose it the game can quickly fall apart.
the other problem with federer is that he had a double psych advantage, both his own delusional ego and the fact opponents were beaten before they went on court. he’s lost both of these advantages.
on top of that the level has gone up, the other top players caught up to him and some surpassed him. the reality is that the djoker and nadal of today would beat federer in his prime in hard court slam conditions the majority of the time.
murray would also find success, and even berdych would get quite a few wins.

injuries aside, in many ways federer is actually better than he was during his mid 20s. his backhand is significantly better, his serve is probably more varied. he added an effective drop shot… as for his forehand, he always sprayed it somewhat, he was splashing the mediterranean years ago at montecarlo, it’s just he often got away with it against lesser opposition, he could always still hit his way ”into form” or ”out of trouble”. people just watch highlights and pretend he dominated everybody and hit forehand winners from the middle of the racquet all day long and it’s simply not true.

December 4th, 2013 at 1:15 am

@skeezer

Have you ever thought you might be contributing to some of those posts ? As far as I can tell, you never let an opportunity go by to bash Rafa. You use phrases like ‘Nadull’, ‘hypocrite’ etc. even when there isn’t any need. My understanding is that this ‘vamos here’ ‘vamos that’ is in response to some of your childish posts. Then we have Ben Pronin who uses phrases like ‘Fraud’ for Rafa and then expects people to have ‘rational discussions’ with him.

I really like to have intelligent discussions with Federer fans but may be you guys also need to look at what sort of words you use. You might realize that you are part of the problem.

December 4th, 2013 at 1:15 am

@hamza,
C”mon dude.
Like “fedfan”, federazzi”. Wtf?
Instead of looking at Fed posts, look at the giles, hawknose, holdserve, mem, rafaone, rafalove, eleonor, roy, rafamylove, rafamylife, slice tennis posts, etc, etc, and maybe you’ll find why your fav gets so much critizism. It’s not so much about Rafa, but the vamosheads that CREATE the smack.

@roy
One thing I agree with you, despite Rafa’s attack on Feds BH with success, it has improved. The last AO Fed won which was against Andy Murray, he displayed a clinic with his BH to win that Slam. Also …..Fed’s BH turned into a weapon in the past against Rafa @WTF and IW as an example. He has the ability there, but consistent? Nah, Rafa will still pound it till further notice.

December 4th, 2013 at 1:29 am

@skeezer

For all I know, you’re one of the oldest persons who has been posting on the blog. Can you definitively say that you’ve only called Nadal ‘Nadull’, a ‘Hypocrite’ etc. when the Rafa fans started the ‘vamosing’ ? The vamosing is a VERY recent phenomenon on tennis-x. In fact, the first time I saw somebody using hashtags on tennis-x was you. Am I wrong in that ? I don’t recall any vamosing happening 6 months ago but I do remember needless hashtags. In response to your hashtagging, I started observing that Hawkeye started using hashtags.

I’m willing to be proved wrong but I’m not convinced that you simply *react* to the vamosing.
Take away the vamosing, and Ben would still call Rafa a ‘Fraud’ , and you’ll still call Rafa a ‘Hypocrite’. Correct ? If I’m wrong, I’m willing to apologize. If I’m not wrong, then you should stop complaining about the excessive vamosing because you’re to be blamed equally for it.

December 4th, 2013 at 3:27 am

^ preach it!

December 4th, 2013 at 4:01 am

Glad to see Roger staying so optomistic, but also honest with his answers. He hasn’t been moving as well, anyone can see that. Who knows what Roger realy is thinking, but you can see Roger’s body language on the court and just know he’s not happy with how he’s hitting the ball at times. You see him looking frustrated and practicing his swing when he mishits more and more. Sure he’s discouraged, but who’s to say Roger can’t hang in there if he just keeps a level of consistency. He did it at Wimbledon in 2012 with his last two matches. He wasn’t perfect, but he came through when it mattered. That’s what he needs to work on, consistency. Hopefully his hard work pays off next year. Here’s hoping.

December 4th, 2013 at 4:32 am

People are always stumbling all over themselves to be the first to call time of death on Federer’s career. As if that was some kind of accomplishment to be proud of!

Anyhow, if you always say “This is the end” at some point you’ll be right. Stopped clocks and all that. So what? Does being a stopped clock make you a prophet?

People cheer for Federer because they sense he’s still giving his all to the sport even as the road gets harder. They sense his struggle to produce the highest level of tennis which he’s capable of. Only when he leaves, will the critics will realize what a giant hole he will leave in the sport.

You take the summer sun for granted until it’s gone and cold cold winter arrives. It’s only then that you start missing it.

But while winter is only temporary and gives way to spring, Federer’s retirement will be forever. So enjoy the sun while it’s here. You don’t know how much longer it will last.

December 4th, 2013 at 5:23 am

Hamza,

I am here as long as Skeezer and his “change” in tactics was a defensive move, he was always Pro Fed. This site was and still kind of is pro Fed, but who as a tennis lover isn’t?!:-)
Joking aside, once somebody mentioned that tennistalk ended, than I understood what was going on here and why this site change completely from what it was, I mean the bloggers. Even Ben kind of lost his temper and that’s why you see him posting like this, it got to an annoying point where most of the old ones left. And it’s not just because this was Rafa’s year. I am here since 2005 and with all shifts in rankings during, Nadal first ascend to #1, Djoko etc. it was never like this. It became somewhat..childish.
We used to have long arguing fights here, and even declared war between posters but mostly debating tennis with several knowledge posters who went aol lately.
The tone shifted a bit, sorry if I offended some, but is my take on it.

Also, Fed is aging and declining and this must have contribute to the shift for some extend as non Fed fans will have the upper bragging aside. I want to stay here ling enough to see the days Nadal and Djoko are at lower end of top 10 or lower to see how this same posters will behave. Time will tell!

December 4th, 2013 at 7:01 am

I’ve lurked here for quite some time and the tennis talk was more lets say respectable as long as posters felt free to bash and minimize Rafa’s achievements as it was primarily a fed site (which the blogs continue to be).

The recent childishness is on both sides.

December 4th, 2013 at 7:11 am

roy,

So, if speed doesn’t affect their games (specially Fed in your case, as you constantly dismiss aging as non factor), How many more years you think Nadal will hold #1, just because he “compensated with superior technique, power and tactics”?!

You can’t beat father time, no one can. What Fed is doing is maximizing the most oh his abilities, but to pretend or assume this Nadal and Djoko are better than Fed in his prime years is too much. Back then the ball landed in Fed’s forehand and it was virtually point over. The guy is 32 and you act like he plays the same or better than when he was 26. Hope you apply the same standard when Nadal and Djoko are 32. We’ll see how their rankings, how many titles will be then and even if they will be able to win Slams after 30, which Fed and few other did.
#timewilltell

December 4th, 2013 at 7:11 am

Hmmm, I WONDER who first started using hashtags on tennis forums?

HINT: it wasn’t on Tennis-X

Anyhoo, yes no one can beat father time. That said, fedfan played some of the best tennis of his career in 2012, no?

Nadal and even Murray beat fedfan more often than not during fedfan’s heyday and they were no where near their peak. Regardless of whether they were better than fedfan or not (subjective) facts are facts (objective).

Vamos!

December 4th, 2013 at 8:36 am

@Daniel
You nailed it. Both posts.

December 4th, 2013 at 9:31 am

People can see that Roger is not that fast anymore. I don’t know how much it’s affecting his game. He needs to force his opponent to do the running, that is for sure. If he is struggling with his back, that is not helping either. There were other players who had back problems to the end of their career, so it might not really go away again.
Anyway, it’s not so much a problem if he loses to the top guys, but against those lower ranked players. Some of them had certainly gained more hope against him last year. That is the first point he has to take care of.
Even though I’m not a fan of him, I have never written him off. I like normal discussions between fans of different players, but it has become nearly impossible.

December 4th, 2013 at 9:47 am

“the other problem with federer is that he had a double psych advantage, both his own delusional ego and the fact opponents were beaten before they went on court. he’s lost both of these advantages.”

The problem with this is that there is a strange assumption that Federer came on tour one day and suddenly had this aura/psych advantage. This is obviously not the case. He earned it the way everyone else did, by working his butt off to become the best. He slowly built the aura by being better than everyone. And then sustained that aura by being better than everyone. And when Djokovic and Nadal caught up/surpassed him, the aura started to fade, slowly.

Delusional ego? I don’t really get that, so I’m not going to bother.

Federer’s decline similar to Davydenko? Yes, similar. They both relied on superior footwork and once they slowed down, their games took a hit. Sprinters peaking at 30 is irrelevant to tennis. Tennis isn’t about sheer speed, it’s about implementing speed into superior footwork. I don’t see how Nadal has slowed down at all. Just watch the Indian Wells final from this year he looked faster than ever. But it doesn’t matter, but he has great footwork, most of the time. He still struggles a bit on hard and grass. The reason Federer used to dominate the big hitters and now struggles against them starts and ends with his footwork. In his faster days, he was always balanced and anticipated better than anyone. He is off balance way more nowadays.

Daniel, spot on.

December 4th, 2013 at 10:27 am

http://alturl.com/94njb
IF………

December 4th, 2013 at 10:40 am

Its interesting that Rafa has the same number of GS that Roger had at the same age,so it would be ironic if both were to end their careers with the same number,Rafa would need to win more to be regarded as the greater player,otherwise as Daniel said then other permatitions would come in to context to determine who would be the greater,so then Rafa would fall short due to the superior weeks at number 1 and WTFs that Roger has,although winning the AO would surely cement his status as number 2 on that list,personally i think he might just fall between Sampras and Federer,overtaking possibly Sampras but winning another 5 seems a rather tall order.

December 4th, 2013 at 11:56 am

I don’t get it. All Federer is doing here is acknowledging he has had a bad year and hoping 2014 will be better…so why the snide and sarcastic remarks from Humble Rafa, Giles, Hawkeye et al. Has he insulted or put down your favorite player in any way? Is there anything arrogant in what he said? Heck, Fed even said Djokovic is correct in stating that he has lost a step or two.

Given the kind of year he has had, I would have thought that the folks in the Nadal camp would be happy to wish him well and leave it at that. But no, they have to pass snide remarks…it’s okay to dream…nightmare starts in Brisbane…My oh My…what would bad back rules say, etc. etc.

There is nothing wrong with rooting for your player, but to mock Federer for stating he hopes to have a better year ahead is simply uncalled for. In all the years I have been coming to this site, Humble Rafa has not had one positive thing to say about Federer without the mocking tone.

Get off it guys, grow up…I mean this for people in both camps. Increasingly, the comments are getting to be more than childish…they are mean and petty. In trying to belittle Federer (or Nadal), you are only belittling yourselves.

December 4th, 2013 at 11:59 am

No, according to Daniel, WTF titles aren’t part of the tennis community’s general consensus.

I would have to agree with Daniel on this.

Exhos don’t count either.

December 4th, 2013 at 12:03 pm

NK top post,especially the last paragraph,very well said.

December 4th, 2013 at 12:05 pm

I love Rudyard Kiplings poem IF,and i love Roger and Rafa reading it at Wimbledon,it brings a tear to my eye and a lump in my throat,thanks for the link Giles,i wish the fan groups had the same respect as these two greats have for each other.

December 4th, 2013 at 12:15 pm

My BadBackRules comment was directed towards the T-X poster @BadKneeRules who has a MONIKER that’s continually a “snide and sarcastic remark”.

You mention you “mean this for people in both camps” (fair enough, I completely agree with you) yet somehow you only name posters in the Rafa camp. Coincidence?

No, it’s very telling.

Vamos!

December 4th, 2013 at 12:19 pm

i love Roger and Rafa reading it at Wimbledon,it brings a tear to my eye
—
Why tears? Because I beat him on grass too?

December 4th, 2013 at 12:36 pm

@Chic

I too have always loved that poem, fitting for these two great champions!! “I wish the fan groups……..me too, Chic. I have noticed if you post something nice about someone other than your fav, you might get a response, but not often. If you say something nice about your fav, the fight is on. So, my belief is that most posters enjoy being argumentative.

Oklahoma is waiting for a major ice storm, if we lose our electricity, I lose internet…..boo hoo!!

December 4th, 2013 at 12:38 pm

^and there ya go.

December 4th, 2013 at 12:45 pm

Humble Rafa read NKs post.

December 4th, 2013 at 12:48 pm

This has been the case for 3 years. It didn’t hurt Agassi quite as much when he lost a step because his backhand was as good as his forehand. He didn’t need that quickness to run around his backhand in order to be offensive.

December 4th, 2013 at 2:03 pm

Agassi was never that fast to begin with. He could look slow even in his early 20s. His ability to work points and anticipate was his main strength. He wanted to be the one working the string, not the one being worked. He let 41 aces by him when he played Joachim Johansson and still won in 4 sets. Think about that for a second. 41 points you don’t even get a racket on, and still only drop a set.

December 4th, 2013 at 3:12 pm

Hawkeye,

WTF matters. But is seco dary to Slams, weeks as number 1 and year end numebr 1.

If we add WTF where fed is record holder, consecutive weeks as number one and all his consistancy records: 23 straight semis in slams, 30+ quarters in slams plus more than 50+ Slams played in sucession, that is what makes him GOAT and some don’t get it / agree.

Nadal may have the Slami haul in the future, but the complete resume matters, the guy can’t even play 6 Slams in a row this days and as much as it was a wise decision to not return to AO it’s a Slam. He could have easlily olayed there last year even with slims chances to win. He will never have the consistancy records (but at least he has the. Most year in a row winnjg slam at 9 and counting). He also has no WTF and his chances there are getting shorten. Maube more 2-3 chancesa nd that’s it. If he is not winning indoors after the year he had he won’t be winning that tourney if he gets older.

December 4th, 2013 at 3:19 pm

For the most part Roger’s body language doesn’t support the idea that he’s just happy to be out there. I hope he’s right about putting things right and getting back on track, but if not I hope he’s willing to put away the racquet. Watching a champion like Roger go through loss and disappointment time and again doesn’t put a smile on my face. I know what “just happy to be here” looks like, and that’s not what Roger has looked like after his losses this year. He looked like Rafa after his 5th or 6th loss to Novak a few years ago. Rafa was just 25 and had time on his side. Roger is 33 next year so not much time left if any.

December 4th, 2013 at 3:29 pm

Giles, how could you post that embarrassing video? (Well I knew someone would.) It’s a ghastly poem only suitable for parody….see above….and to involve Fedal was a rare and cringe-worthy mistake by the Wimbledon authorities.
PS: on the subject of hashtags, am I right in thinking they were first observed on Tennis Talk? Hawkeye, perhaps you know as your name suggests visual superiority.

December 4th, 2013 at 6:19 pm

Oh Purcell, I have absolutely no idea who started hashtags on TennisTalk. A fine fellow no doubt.

;)

But while lurking on T-X, skeezer was the first I observed.

Perhaps he lurked there and secretly admired whoever started it there.

Hmmm… I wonder.

You like my name? You should try googling another poster’s name. Telling.

Nice chatting with you dear Purcell.

Ta Ta!!

December 4th, 2013 at 7:01 pm

“Hawkeye, perhaps you know as your name suggests visual superiority.”

That’s gotta be the single funniest thing I’ve read on this blog in months.

December 4th, 2013 at 10:00 pm

For heaven sake – Rog has climbed the highest mountains and has trophies to prove that he is the greatest – leave him alone and let him enjoy the autumn of his career – a good saying ” I WAS WHAT YOU ARE, I AM IS WHAT YOU WILL BE” (without the love and affection of supporters world wide)

December 4th, 2013 at 11:59 pm

TIME for a fresh article TX-STAFF….!!

It is my humble request to you guys to post something exclusive abt Nole & Andy too….ain’t they making any news??…. or you ppl think they won’t make exciting debate stuff??

I dnt remember the last article i read which was exclusively written for anyone (apart from roger or rafa)….I understand they are GIANTS and they draw a lot of attention but think abt other fans as well who wud simply sign out the moment they see posts from rafans & fedfans hurling insults at each other even on topics like, “rafa cut his finger” or “fed spoke to the Pope”, blah-blah….

Thr r lotsa exciting players like Delpo, Ferrer, Dmitrov, etc. ….may be some upcoming players who r the nex fed or rafa in the making….I m sure lotta ppl will enjoy reading & learning same. Heck..I dnt remember the last post based on WTA. I m sure too many ppl will be following WTA too (esp. girls) and they too might be interested to knw wat Serena or vika or maria are upto b4 the 2014 season & wat r they doin in the off-season….

See the point is simple. Pl bring in some variety to this forum to make it more exciting & enjoyable to visit rather than prying around the same old trick to find out ways to make the “F” & “N” worshippers to bash each other heads up.

Just a request and opinion….nothin else!!

December 5th, 2013 at 2:24 am

Purcell i was sorry that you felt that way about that video,i thought it was quite fitting and touching,two fantastic champions with such mutual respect for each other,especially as this was one of the greatest finals ever,and one of the greatest rivalries ever,still just my take.

December 5th, 2013 at 5:03 am

Perfect Fan theres a thread about Vera Zvonareva,who was actually a very prominent player on the WTA circuit a couple of years ago,shes sufferered some injuries and slipped down in the rankings but is a former world number 2 player,and also made a couple of GS finals,and is actually making a comeback,shes actually a player with a great game too,yet hardly any comments on that thread.

December 5th, 2013 at 5:19 am

@Purcell. I wouldn’t expect you types to appreciate Rudyard Kipling’s IF after the gibberish you produced on 3rd Dec. at 1.47 pm. Read TXHC’s post on 4th Dec. at 12.15 pm.
#Phillistine

December 5th, 2013 at 5:49 am

@alison. To each his own. Why do you have to apologise to Purcell?

December 5th, 2013 at 5:53 am

Giles true,i just thought it was a bit of a shame that Purcell didnt see the good in that link.

December 5th, 2013 at 6:05 am

I enjoyed Jenni Cramers post @11-59pm December 4th,we have a saying here in Blighty and it goes
Be carefull who you kick when your climbing your way to the top,as the same people can kick twice as hard on the way down.

December 5th, 2013 at 7:07 am

“tennis talk was more lets say respectable …”
LMAO. Only if you were a Rafa fan. Murrey type fan was the only other type that was welcome cause he posed no threat to Rafa. Otherwise it was just a worthless talk back and forth about “my” Rafa. It wa a Rafa club site for sure.

“Exhos don’t count either.” You keep tryim to make weak attempts and back handed comments that WTF is like or is an exho.
Who says? Apparently only the minion Hawkeye .
Now is that with one Hawkeye or 2? Wait let me guess, all the peers and couches past present said it, no? And no, one sportswriter who loves Rafa doesnt count. Otherwise stfu about it already. It’s not an exho. Hiw can you tell the difference? Simple, and you don’t need hawkeyes to see.
ATP points.

December 5th, 2013 at 10:30 am

No, not just one writer no longer accepts fedfan as defacto GOAT.

Many say that Rafa has an argument as GOAT, with some of the listed players below already saying he is the King.

We now have Sampras, Agassi, Courier, Blake, McEnroe, Murray, Djokovic, Gilbert and so many others coming to the same conclusion as will many more as Nadal continues to grow his legacy!

At the 10:30 mark in the video below, Nole states unequivocally “It’s always a pleasure to play you, You are a great champion. For me, you are the greaetest player ever.”

He has said it before and Muzz has said the same. JMac another.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2ru3oHmByHA

But perhaps Novak hasn’t watched the game with his club friends for a long time.

Phenomenadal!!!!

Vamos!!!!!

December 5th, 2013 at 11:32 am

Andy Murray Says:
‘There are many things I could have done a bit better tonight – but I didn’t. He’s probably the greatest player to play tennis.’

http://metro.co.uk/2011/09/11/andy-murray-loses-to-greatest-ever-rafael-nadal-at-us-open-152015/

These comments from Nole and Muzz were from 2011 when Nadal had just 10 majors and fewer weeks at No. 1 with zero WTF titles.

They must not be part of the tennis community I guess.

December 5th, 2013 at 11:37 am

I thought Roger looked like old Roger in some of his matches. His shot making was great. I think if it goes to three he loses his legs. At his age, that is gonna happen. You tennis players out there….is it possible, at his age to work on stamina and get in better shape to last longer or will age take precedence over that?? Just curious. I think confidence is another issue plus the back. I am glad he is giving it a go and continuing to play on. Best of luck for Roger in 2014!!

December 5th, 2013 at 12:16 pm

The WTF is not an exhibition. The players talk all year about making it to the WTF. Players wouldn’t talk like this about a tournament they didn’t regard highly. Round robin tournament does not = exo. The World Cup has a round robin. The hockey tournament at the Olympics has one too. I don’t think that any of the players competing in these events consider them exo’s anymore han tennis players consider the WTF an exo.

December 5th, 2013 at 12:33 pm

Yes, you can lose in a round robin tournament and still win the whole thing. But these rules apply to all the players.

December 5th, 2013 at 12:34 pm

No, WTF is not an exhibition. The fact that you need to argue for it is hilarious!

In order of importance, physical exertion, risk of injury:

1. Tournaments worth points:
– Majors
– ATP (incl. WTF), Olympics, DC, etc.

2. Practise (where players must push themselves to tournament levels of play as close as possible).

3. Exhos (the pay is better than 1 and 2 but you can’t get it without 1 and 2).

Some tea party types can’t understand rhetoric and exaggeration (yet unknowingly practise it themselves.)

That’s the last time I’m saying it.

Too funny!

December 5th, 2013 at 12:45 pm

I dont think the WTF is an exho,however i just hate the format,the idea that a player can lose a couple of matches yet still make the final and win the thing is something rather bizarre IMO be it in tennis or any other sport for that matter,ok its the top 8 players,but you dont necassarily have to beat all the players in your group to win,i can imagine the comments had Rafa or Novak won it yet had lost a couple of matches on the way to the final,which is something that Dave alluded to a year ago when Novak won it for the first time meaning Novaks win lost some of its credibility,ok in a GS your are not facing the top players till the second week,but you dont get the luxury of losing a match yet still been in the tourney with a chance of been in the final and winning the trophy,and im not saying this as a sourpuss Rafa fan just because he has not the WTF either.

December 5th, 2013 at 12:47 pm

And above I meant Tennis-X, not Tennis Talk.

Tennis-X was more friendly and respectful 98% of the time.

2% a poster would slag Nadal, a cuople would agree and that would be the end of it, right?

Ah yes, the good old days!

December 5th, 2013 at 12:51 pm

hawkeye
I don’t drink tea.
And you’re wrong……again.
You have been more than serious leading up to, during and after trying to take down the significance of WTF, claiming its nothing more than an exho mainly to cover the FACT that Rafa, being on the tour since 2001, hasn’t won this “significant” event. Stop it, it’s am outright lie u constantly bring up, not a joke. Try something else if you must entertain yourself.

December 5th, 2013 at 12:56 pm

Alison, the RR format is on the rule book and yes, in this format it makes sense. There are only 8 spots, not 128 nor 64. Can you imagine an 8 man draw? You play only 3 times to win. Not enough to earn a trophy. ;)

December 5th, 2013 at 12:59 pm

Since I noticed everybody is getting into the World Tour finals debate, I will chime with a post I posted on bleacher report:

Actually the World Tour Finals is almost as prestigious as slams IMO. The only tournament in the whole ATP that you have to earn the right to play as only the top eight players are only eligible. This means a players whole year of hard work is awarded and put to fruition. No easy draws for top players, unlike the slams where often the first three rounds are usually just target practice for the top players. In a slam, Djokovic would not likely have to face someone like a Federer till at least the quarters, if not the semis or finals. Guess what, Djokovic got Federer for his very first match of the WTF and vice versa. Furthermore, to win the tournament, you usually have to beat at least four top 8 players. How many top 10 players does a champion have to beat to win a slam? Now I’m not saying the WTF is more prestigious than a slam by any means considering that slams require a player to win three sets each match rather than two, but that the World Tour Finals comes in at a very close 2nd to the slams and should not be disregarded just because everybody’s favorite clay warrior has never won it. And by the way, Federer didn’t win it five times, but rather six. He beat Nadal and Tsonga in the finals to win the 2010 and 2011 championships respectively. Djokovic has now won this event three times. Pete Sampras won the Year End championships five times and Nadal 0. Not to take anything away from Nadal though, he has had an excellent season and deserves to be number one. Cheers!

To further elaborate:

Regarding the WTF, I think it is bluntly disregarded by some people for whatever reason. I see it as a mini-slam as it is less prestigious than slams, but more more prestigious than master 1,000s. Slams 2,000 points, WTF 1,500 points, and Master 1000s naturally 1,000s points. What I don’t understand is why some people overate the Olympics and underrate the WTF to the point of even putting it behind master 1,000s and call it “a glorified exhibition”! Last time I checked, exhibitions don’t reward you 1,500 points for winning, require only the top 8 players to qualify through a year’s hard work, and require a player to beat the best of the best. Any thoughts?

December 5th, 2013 at 1:20 pm

Wow. very telling that the last post was allowed but not the two prior with direct quotes from Nole and Muzz.

I guess this one will be removed as well.

There he goes reading out the riot act again, hey @Wilson.

December 5th, 2013 at 1:22 pm

Alison,

spain lost to switzerland in fifa 2010 world cup, yet they won the trophy. On the other hand switzerland didn’t even qualify for the next round.

Does that mean that spain is not worthy of the WC trophy? ;)

December 5th, 2013 at 1:29 pm

Skeezer yeah i get that,and i get the format,i just dont agree with the format,i hate RRs whether its tennis,football or otherwise,JMO.

December 5th, 2013 at 1:36 pm

Sirius im not saying that they are not worthy,all im saying is the win loses some of its credibility,still JMO sorry i ever mentioned it(sigh).

December 5th, 2013 at 1:41 pm

Don’t be sorry. I was only kidding :)

December 5th, 2013 at 1:44 pm

In football we have a system called the play offs in the lower leagues,the top 3 teams are promoted automatically,then the next 4 teams face each other to decide the next promotion spot,now i dont think i would find it fair somehow if a team finished ten points behind another in the league were to get promoted instead,alright not quite the same but its still similar to a RR,which i just dont think is fair.

December 5th, 2013 at 1:54 pm

That said hopefully Rafa will win the WTF before he retires whether i hate the format or not,that way he wont be regarded as such a failure.

December 5th, 2013 at 2:02 pm

I think the WTF year end tournament should be a five setter affair, like the slams, IMHO.

December 5th, 2013 at 2:06 pm

^That post was just to prove that im not some sourpuss Rafa fan,and bitter because he has not won the WTF as yet^.

December 5th, 2013 at 2:09 pm

Im not saying that the Olympics is more important than the WTF as personally i would not know either way,but i dont think its significance should be down graded either,as you are playing for a medal for your country,the tournament only happens every 4 years,otherwise why would they all bother,and look how happy Andy,Roger and Delpo all were when they all got their medals,likewise all the other males and females who won medals in their own different fields of sport,its the top honour for your country,still again JMO for what its worth.

December 5th, 2013 at 3:08 pm

Nah TXHC, haven’t you heard?

Anything Rafa has achieved that fedfan hasn’t is, by definition, not as important (including Nadal’s domination of fedfan, clay, gold medals).

The tennis community generally accepts this, no?

December 5th, 2013 at 3:22 pm

Agree about olympics. It definitely has some value. Otherwise players wouldn’t even bother to play it. Its a bit sad for me that federer couldn’t win it in 2004 when he was having a superb year. I think he should’ve won it in then, but berdych had other plans

December 5th, 2013 at 6:21 pm

@Tennis X Hippy Chic: Fair enough. While the Olympics hasn’t been significant in the past history of tennis, it has picked up some steam after the last couple of Olympics. For fairness sake, let’s put the Olympics and the WTF as equal in the realm of achievements. I do think that the Olympics should give a player more points than a paltry 750. The unique thing about it is it has a best of five final and there are no tiebreaks if the match goes to a 3rd set. You should look up the Federer vs. Delpotro match that went the distance. The WTF is unique in that it is put in a round robin format and players have to work hard to earn points throughout the whole year. In addition, it is the only tournament where every match requires a player to beat an elite opponent. Nadal lacks a WTF and Federer and Djokovic lack an Olympic Gold( in singles). Either way, I think we can agree that winning six WTF’s outweighs 1 Olympic Gold. However, the good news is that they hold the WTF every year which will still give Nadal plenty of chances to win one. My opinion is that if Nadal at least equals Fed’s number of grandslams, wins a double career grand slam, and at least one WTF, then you can book the legendary red bull that rules the red sand as the greatest of all-time! You heard it everybody. Djokovic, while stepping his level up since 2011, likely won’t reach Federer and Nadal’s achievements simply because he was too much of a late bloomer and likely does not have enough time. What are your thoughts on the GOAT debate?

December 5th, 2013 at 6:25 pm

@ TXHC AT 5:19 AM (Dec 5th):

I knew abt that article reg VERA u r talking of…rather i had actually wished her luck thr if u see. But my point was just to emphasize on the need of bringing in more variety & different topics to this forum to enrich and improve the quality of tennis talk. I m not saying that there is sheer bs going on here..rather a lot of posters are indeed making some excellent points here (apart from some avoidable stupid mindless comments here & there). But i think with majority of topics covering either roger or rafa has become quite monotonous and boring at times bcoz almost all the time the topic ends up in a debate that who is GOAT….which honestly puts me off and I m sure a lot of other ppl too.

Thats why i requested that there shud be a proper balance to it by covering up (frequently) varied topics from other areas like WTA, Upcoming teenaged talents, sometimes even legends too who have been retired….just an idea!!

Sometimes it gets too predictable abt these needling posts involving fed & rafa that they are posted intentionally just to bring in more audience and talks….which actually is no wrong, not bad at all. But even with the correct intention, ppl dnt realize that too much of it is degrading the quality of tennis talk here and some great posts ending up with some of the most horrid, senseless & tasteless talks i hav ever read.

But i think this doesn’t seem a problem at all to a lot of ppl….pity!! :(

December 5th, 2013 at 11:55 pm

“Anything Rafa has achieved that fedfan hasn’t is, by definition, not as important (including Nadal’s domination of fedfan, clay, gold medals).”

Not true …….., again. Do we have to have this graffiti type posts here? What does it accomplish?
Just makin up sh!t as u go now…..

December 6th, 2013 at 12:36 am

RIP Nelson Mandela. The world has lost an extraordinary human being and is a sadder place.

December 6th, 2013 at 2:22 am

RIP Nelson Mandela. Legend.

December 6th, 2013 at 3:19 am

Agree with Margot and Giles,Nelson Mandela the definition of a true legend R.I.P.

December 6th, 2013 at 4:36 am

Tennis Guru Schmidt thanks for the reply,and that was exactly my point,the Olympics is only every 4 years as opposed to the WTF which at least you get the chance to rack up the titles every year,not saying its more important than a WTF obviously as i wouldnt know either way?

December 6th, 2013 at 5:12 am

Hawkeye i would rather debate sensibly,i dont see the need to bring these things down to a childish level all the time.

December 6th, 2013 at 5:15 am

Tennis Guru Schmidt agree about the bit on Novak been too much of a late bloomer,not saying hes not an amazing player,but he has Murray whos come of age now to worry about,and also Delpo who seems to be getting back to his 2009 best,those 3 will most likely stop Novak getting anywhere near to Rafa IMO.

December 6th, 2013 at 5:27 am

Perfect Fan im with you honestly it seems people like to bring things down to a childish level these days,ive noticed too that Courbons not been posting lately,i would hope this is only a temporary,i would really love to see some fans of other players posting,Emily is a Delpo fan and her posts are great,likewise Volley a Tsonga fan,i would actually be interested to see some Berdych fans post too,although given how much negativity the guy has to stomach,they probably dont think its worth the bother,which would be a shame really,as all fans should be welcome.

December 6th, 2013 at 6:40 am

Nadalista was a great poster. Don’t know why she has stopped posting, really miss her.
Nadalista if you are reading this, please come back

December 6th, 2013 at 7:08 am

Very true & well said Hippy….imagine a forum with participation from fans of say all top 8 players or even more….OMG!! won’t that be something.

But the bottomline is the topic should be a more generalized one rather than a fedal tonic. To be precise, topics like “who could challenge fed & rafa records in the foreseeable future”, or “wat sort of changes are bound to happen or need to happen in tennis in future”, “whether 5 setter matches in GSs shall be continued or be curtailed”….to name a few. There are many more interseting topics that could be put here which i believe will encourage & excite a lot of tennis fans world wide to put in their views and thoughts.

But now a days it seems nothing is making news other than fed & rafa….which pretty much proves that it is done intentionally (for wat?…. everybody knows). Sometimes i feel, i can count on my fingers how many of the posters are posting in recent days. It rly is pity.

December 6th, 2013 at 7:20 am

Look in the mirror.

It’s TXHC and Daniel that argued fedfan as GOAT on this thread on Dec. 4th before I responded.

I never start that conversation on any thread.

Practise what you preach. Nothing new.

Vamos!

December 6th, 2013 at 7:23 am

Giles agree about Nadalista too :((..

December 6th, 2013 at 7:34 am

Perfect Fan i have to say im a big Kie Nishikori fan,and i would love to see him make a major breakthrough and win a GS one day,granted it might take a few years but i believe that the potential is there,how about talking about which one of the new breed will be 1st to make a breakthrough?or the next Brit to make a breakthrough?i believe our gal Laura is slam potential too after all the upsets she has caused the top players of late,what do you think?

December 6th, 2013 at 7:45 am

Have to say how amazing it was to see Daveed make his 1st GS final this year,unfortunatly it was not to have a fairy tale ending,against anybody else other than Rafa i wouldve rooted for him to lift the trophy at RG.

December 6th, 2013 at 7:55 am

@alison. I am very pro Heather Watson and think she will upstage Laura.

December 6th, 2013 at 8:01 am

Giles i love Heather too,and the exciting thing will be to see which of these two make the breakthrough 1st,Grendel was tipping Laura as she has slightly the better serve,and seems more aggressive,but i love both players so i hope both are bound for great things.

December 6th, 2013 at 8:07 am

Alison….wud u believe if i say that I myself is also a big nishikori fan….his cool demeanor and aggressive play at the same time wins my heart. I think he idolizes fed, as his coolness looks very fed-like and he actually has a huge forehand and a great mover on court. I hav nvr seen him lose control on his emotions too which is a big plus for a youngster like him. I rly wish that he wins a slam at some point (i think it may be on either AO or USO as he does play well on HCs).

Now coming on to WTA, i find Lisciki & Stephens very promising gals. I think lisciki particularly is going to rue her missed chances at wimby this year for a long time….but she seems to play so effortlessly on grass, it is hard to believe that she won’t win a slam there. And I have seen stephens play and she does play real good….a big forehand & a big serve as well. I feel she is going to be a future multi-slam queen.

Well, i also find Laura to be a good prospect for GB and at times she dazzles with her sharp game….but it seems she has to work rly hard as her game drops at crucial times….she rly need to wrk on being consistently good to pose any challenge to the slam queens. But I think she is pretty young and has enuff time on her side to prove her mettle. wat ya say..?

December 6th, 2013 at 8:16 am

Hoping Pospisil can continue to improve and get into the Top 20 this year.

He started the year at No. 125 and finished at No. 32 and should be seeded at the AO!!!

Handles himself very well on the court. Mentally strong. Good overall skills with a great serve.

Quite an improvement!

Anything is Pospisil!

December 6th, 2013 at 8:24 am

Alison….just curious, is there another atp player(s) from GB in the top 100 or so?? I somehow cud not collect….seems tennis is not that popular amongst men there, is it?

December 6th, 2013 at 8:54 am

Dan Evans is No. 150 and James Ward is No. 161.

December 6th, 2013 at 8:59 am

Perfect Fan Lisicki played some fantasic tennis this year,against both Serena and Agie in the semis,two fantastic matches,its unfortunate that she ran out of steam in what was a lack lustre final against Bartoli in the final,agree about Laura in that she lets her head drop which is not a good thing to do as oponents thrive on negative body language,SS is another promising player with a great game,i like Bouchard too.

December 6th, 2013 at 9:00 am

Perfect Fan ooh now your asking hmm not sure to be honest,i think Dan Evans is the closest,and hes had quite a good year this year,beat Kie(sorry Kie)1st round at the USO this year,not sure where hes ranked Brando or Margot might have abetter idea,i have a memory of a goldfish 11 seconds.

December 6th, 2013 at 9:06 am

Alison….I m even worse….”I m the 10 second TOM”, remember him in the fantastic movie, “50 first dates”….one of my all time favourite films. Btw, Adam Sandler is one of my fav actor too :))

December 6th, 2013 at 9:14 am

Giles: if you’re going to criticise/insult at least spell Philistine with one ‘l’ and stop using those silly TT hashtags. Regarding ‘your types’, at least I can appreciate the fantastic and indeed the superior mince pies and Bakewell Tarts Mr Kipling was encouraged to produce in order to make up for his dreadful poetry. Now that’s gibberish…… unless you’re British.

December 6th, 2013 at 9:22 am

Perfect Fan ive never seen 50 1st Dates although i do love Adam Sandler,i think my favorite actor would be someone like Jack Nicholson or Robert De Niro,but if it were about looks then Hugh Jackman as i am so shallow lol,i will talk later as i have to go to work now tara and out.

December 6th, 2013 at 9:23 am

Alison, catch u later….but if u like sweet romantic films, go for this movie. U’ll love it….comedy and romance beautifully gelled together. And btw, adam sandler is just one of my all time fav. List. My most favourites r Tom Hanks and Morgan Freeman. :)

December 6th, 2013 at 9:41 am

@ Purcell. Enjoying supermarket bakery says a lot about you types. You should try the up market kind sometime.
#Phillllistine

December 6th, 2013 at 10:52 am

hawkeye Says:

Anything is Pospisil!

——-

LOL! Very clever. Great T-shirt slogan for him.

I’m pulling for Pospy as well. I like his game more than Raonic’s and he’s a far better athlete. He’s been steadily improving and ascending through the rankings. It’d be nice to see him win an M250 this year and win some matches in the slams.

December 6th, 2013 at 12:37 pm

I’m too late!

http://teespring.com/anythingispospisil

Yeah I like Raonic because he’s Canadian but Vashy has a more entertaining game and I’d be a fan regardless of where he’s from.

C’mon!!!!!

December 6th, 2013 at 12:47 pm

BTW Margot, did you see this interview with Dani Vallerdu?

http://www.tennistopic.com/centre-court/entrevistas/la-otra-cara-de-murray/

According to him the recovery has been smooth sailing and they’re on target to make the AO.

December 6th, 2013 at 1:24 pm

Nice article, Roger asked for it:

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/novak-djokovic-refreshes-roger-federers-memory-162200751–ten.html

December 6th, 2013 at 3:30 pm

The DA thanks for the info on our Andy,it seems ages since we last saw him play.

December 6th, 2013 at 5:33 pm

@ the DA
Yes, ta, had seen it. Thought it was very interesting, about their history together, and reasssuringly positive both about Andy’s motivation and his recovery.
YAY!
Andy is up for BBC’s SPOTY award, on 15th Dec. Up against Mo, Ben Ainslie and Leigh Halfpenny among others. Really like them too and Halfpenny is such a little cutie…..;)
Rumours are Andy might be there, though voting is on the night so its no shoe in.

December 7th, 2013 at 2:13 am

Margot i made a comment about you some months ago to another poster,and i just wanted to say that i do not think you were ever a bully on TT and for that you have my apologies :))..

December 7th, 2013 at 5:06 am

@Bad Knee Rules

It’s no secret that there is bad blood between Fed and Novak, ever since he told Novak’s parents to be quiet. It’s no surprise that he would give Rafa praise because those two belong to a mutual admiration society…….theirs!! I think you could say that they were friends on and off the court. I think Rafa and Novak are too…….now I won’t go as far to say bosom buddies, but tolerable.

December 7th, 2013 at 1:18 pm

Giles:so bagels, breadsticks and Nadal’s buns with a hash brown (Philistine) on the side.

December 7th, 2013 at 6:01 pm

Nice to see some creative and amusing tennis at Statoil @ Albert Hall. It’s a quiet time so this fills a little niche.

December 7th, 2013 at 6:07 pm

Today, I started pratice for the Australian Open. Uncle Toni says, always start with the basics.

I spent 8 hours practicing the art of lining up water bottle. It’s all about routines.

December 7th, 2013 at 9:21 pm

@Purcell
Have so enjoyed watching Mac, my personal GOAT. Still with plenty of magic in the old box and still with volleys to die for.
What’s that quote, something like, “bow down you mortals and despair.” Yep, sums up unique his talent perfectly.

December 8th, 2013 at 8:44 am

Bah!
Edit: “his unique talent.”

December 8th, 2013 at 8:46 am

On a side note, how long does everyone think that Serena Williams can keep up her dominance? It’s difficult to say because she’s in her 30’s, yet has had numerous breaks from the game. My opinion is that she can keep it up for 2-3 years and then she either fades or retires. Regarding Lisicki, there is loads of potential as she has upset numerous French Open champions at Wimbledon. Why does she play good on grass and not so good on other surfaces? Any thoughts?

December 8th, 2013 at 9:24 pm

You and Djokovic?!! You are no longer in his class. Wake up.

January 27th, 2014 at 8:28 am

[…] December Federer said it could take him until April for him to get back up to speed with his health and […]

February 23rd, 2014 at 10:06 am