Murray, Roddick, Hewitt, Haas Winners at Wimbledon
by Staff | June 28th, 2009, 3:18 am

Andy Murray, Andy Roddick, Lleyton Hewitt and Tommy Haas led the favorites and resurgent veterans into the round of 16 on Saturday at Wimbledon.
Murray cruised past Serbia’s Viktor Troicki 6-2, 6-3, 6-4, to line up a meeting with Switzerland’s Stan Wawrinka.

“It was a very good performance,” said Murray. “I felt a little uncomfortable at the start and the conditions were difficult with the rain and clouds. I was more comfortable after the first set and I’m happy with my first week here. But I have to play better if I want to win the title.”

Hewitt, showing few signs of his hip surgery, recorded a 7-5, 7-6(3), 6-3 win over Germany’s Philipp Petzschner, and will next face wily Czech Radek Stepanek.

“It’s not easy to reach the fourth round for a sixth year in a row, but a Grand Slam isn’t won in the first three rounds,” Hewitt said. “It’s all about finding a way through the first week. The draw opens up and you never know what might happen.”

Andy Roddick was a 7-6(2), 7-6(2), 4-6, 6-3 winner over Jurgen Melzer, while Tommy Haas closed out a delayed fifth-set win over Marin Cilic.

“I don’t know why they don’t have lights here,” complained Haas. “I have never stopped a match a 6-6 before in the final set. It’s tough to come back but I’m happy to get through. I think they should be like the US Open and have a tiebreak in the final set,” Haas complained some more. “I could hardly get out of bed today, but the adrenaline took over.”

Haas will next face No. 29 seed Igor Andreev who beat Andreas Seppi of Italy 6-1, 7-6(5), 4-6, 7-6(5) in another formerly delayed match. Other winners were Tomas Berdych over No. 12 seed Nikolay Davydenko in straights, and former No. 1 Juan Carlos Ferrero over No. 10 seed Fernando Gonzalez in five sets.

There will be no play on Sunday at Wimbledon.


Andy Roddick has won 12 straight tiebreaks…

Lleyton Hewitt and Tomas Berdych have yet to drop a single set at Wimbledon…

Go Figure, over $100 million spent on a roof that was never used during week one…

Dudi Sela is the first Israeli to reach the Wimbledon fourth round since Amos Mansdorf in 1989…

Roger Federer will reclaim No. 1 by winning the title…

Dinara Safina, who is into her first Wimbledon fourth round, will hold on to No. 1…

Venus Williams has won 29 straight sets now at Wimbledon. Martina Navratilova holds the record at 40 straight sets…

Fernando Verdasco is the only lefty left in the tournament…

All 16 fourth round matches are played on Monday, with the women’s quarterfinals on Tuesday, men’s quarterfinals on Wednesday…

13 different countries are in the men’s final 16…

No. 70 Juan Carlos Ferrero is the lowest ranked man left…

Tommy Haas and Andy Murray are undefeated on grass this year (8-0). So is Caroline Wozniacki…

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60 Comments for Murray, Roddick, Hewitt, Haas Winners at Wimbledon

huh Says:

All the best to my dearmost brilliant oldies Hewitt,
Ferrero, Haas and Fed ! It’d have been only better with Safin’s presence though. Anyway, come on Golden Oldies… show me all you’ve gott !
You in my eyes have got everything though! ;)

huh Says:

Better late than never but I don’t know what to say about Michael Jackson passing away ! :( I’m a decent dancer myself and he’s been, is and always shall be my inspiration. But most unfortunately…. THE KING IS DEAD and there won’t be a king ever again.

Kimo Says:

I was shocked when I heard about MK’s death. I’m listening to his music now, and not a single song sounds old. I mean if “Beat It” was to be released as a new single right now, it would still get to no.1 on the billboard 100.

And in the age we live in, no one will ever come close to MJ’s place in history. Legends like him are no more. Even the most successful artists right now are pretty content when their records go Gold, some even manage to go Platinum once in their career, but 100 million copies sold of one album. Impossible.

huh Says:

Kimo, I agree with you 100% re MJ. As I said, there won’t again ever be a king. Btw my fav no. is ‘You Rock My World’. MJ truly rocked my world. If Music were a book, MJ would be its best chapter. And to add to it, MJ is the GOAT in dance !

Kimo Says:

I totally agree. MJ is the GOAT.

Tennis Freak Says:

Murray Mania & the Retractable Roof

It does not look right when press people ask players, other than those Murray just played with and the ones who he will play in the following rounds, what they think of Murray, how impressively he’s been playing, how closer he’s getting to Fed, whether he’ll win the title, etc.

Worst example was the interview with Wawrinka 2 days ago (press interview June 25).
Q: (1) Can I just ask you how you think Murray compares to Roger Federer in general terms? (2)Do you think Murray is getting closer to Roger with every year? (3)Which do you think is the tougher opponent?

Before that, they asked Fed, in his 1st and 2nd interviews before the tournament kicked off, more than one fourth of the questions about Murray.

They asked Gulbis before the match if he was intimidated to play Murray in front of the British crowd at the center court fully behind their hope, obviously trying to sow some seeds of fear in Gulbis.

And they asked Djoko and a few others how great Murray is, even the ones who just lost were forced to sing a few lines in Murray’s praise before they were released from the British captivity. A couple of these players were not even remotely related to Murray, were not in Murray’s half of the draw. It must have been painful for them to go through and torturous for us to watch, unless you are a Murray fan.

And the crazy roof…it’s been a routine the British press, which still carries the Victorian gossipy tradition, has been asking every player how great the roof is, not once, sometimes half of the interview revolves around the roof. Apprehensive, Roddick shuts ’em up in one stroke.

Q. You said in the TV interview about the roof. Has there been a lot of talk in the locker room among the guys who may be the first one to play under it?

ANDY RODDICK: No. There’s really not ‑‑ that conversation would be kind of a short one, you know. There’s a roof. If it rains, it closes. Beyond that, we might as well guess what color socks someone is wearing.

I loved Roddick’s answer: socks’ color.

Surprise, surprise, the press and TV commentators have found one thing “bad” about Fed:

TV: At least he’s bad at something (hawk eye challenge)
Q. Federer is one of the worst challengers. Does that surprise you? What do you think of that?

ANDY RODDICK: An irrelevant stat.

This is a mild version of the Murray mania inside the Wimbledon Pres Room. Outside, from BBC through daily tabloids, Mania is ten fold bigger than Henman Hill ever was. Now the rumor of Queen’s gracing the Final and possibility of awarding Murray with knighthood, becoming Sir Andy Murray in the manner of Sir Elton John, if he wins, adds more fuel to the Mania fire.

Kimo Says:

Murray mania is overkill at the moment. Asking what other players think of Murray when chances are they not gonna play him is just too much for me to bear. The moment they swtich to Murray discussions I switch channels.

As or the roof, when they closed it yesterday it seemed like it was hanging very low over the court because of the trusses. Lobs are gonna be hard to execute.

xmike Says:

if the roof is that low, there is always a chance that, if it is closed, karlovic might have to get on his knees or serve underarm :) maybe someone could break his serve then :))

jane Says:

Tennis Freak, when they asked Djoko if he noticed anything different about Murray, he said “new haircut.” I thought that wasn’t a bad way to change the subject either.

Of course, Murray cannot be faulted for the British hype nor the media. What can you do?

huh Says:

Fed, if goes past Soderling, may land up in huge trouble if he faces Ivo in QFs.
His serves, I don’t think can be returned easily at all by Fed. Fed should focus on his serve from now on and must give up the fear of TBs ! He’s playin crap in TBs of late.

TD (Tam) Says:

Tennis Freak I have to agree that nobody puts the media in their place better than Roddick. That could explain why he’s not very popular with the mysterious tennisx “staff”, LOL.

The Murray mania has gone overboard for sure. I dont know how the non Murray fans in Britain can stand it all.

huh Says:

My prediction about Verdasco vs Ivo is that Ivo has more chance of winning. Verdasco needs to remain at his best returning game if he wants to have any chance of winning sets by avoiding TBs.
Ivo’s been serving like insane, too difficult to break him !

huh Says:

Fed better get his TB play right coz he’s gonna need it, may be more than anything else in the next few rounds! Fed’s WIM chances depend on how he serves and plays during TBs, more than his overall servin. The 2nd most important for Fed’s his return game.

Mina Says:

Tennis Freak: I hate when they ask players about other players (other than the opponent they just played and the one immediately upcoming) in the post-match press conferences. It just seems to ridiculous. Wawrinka always seems to have to answer more questions about Federer than about himself. He must have the patience of a saint because that would drive me batty.

tenisbebe Says:

huh Says: “My prediction about Verdasco vs Ivo is that Ivo has more chance of winning. Verdasco needs to remain at his best returning game if he wants to have any chance of winning sets by avoiding TBs.
Ivo’s been serving like insane, too difficult to break him!”

If Ivo serves as well as he did vs Tsonga, obviously he will be next to impossible to beat-he beat Fed after all serving as such. However, if you are going to make a pick why not make it more significant by stating how many sets you think it will go & how many TB’s :-)

btw, I think we all would agree with the above however I WANT Hot Sauce to win. Go Fernando!

sensationalsafin Says:

Who said Fed is sucking in TB’s? He’s 13-4 this year. I wouldn’t call that sucking.

MMT Says:

“As or the roof, when they closed it yesterday it seemed like it was hanging very low over the court because of the trusses. Lobs are gonna be hard to execute.”

It doesn’t seem to be low – it is low. Henman hit the roof in the warm-up with not a very hard shot straight up and I think that’s going to be a problem with defensive lobs which players tend to hit as high as they can.

Despite the over-blow hype, Murray is still my favorite to win the tournament. He’s returning better than anyone, and almost anyone can serve well on grass – including him.

Tennis Freak Says:

Hey MMT,
I went by your blog just now. How often do you update?

My above post “Murray Mania & Retractable Roof” is supplemented with his picture at Tennis Planet. Check out Murray has Jim Morrison look, if you do photoshop editing a little bit.

Tennis Freak Says:

Staff, add to your list of Tennis-X News, Notes, Quotes, and Barbs:

Djokovic is the youngest and Haas is the oldest remaining in the Round of 16.
(Haas defeated Cilic, the youngest in the Rd. of 32, in the last round, and he will repeat the oldest-youngest encounter in the quarter, if both win.)

Colin Says:

I wouldn’t have dreamed of mentioning it here, but since others couldn’t resist dragging the Michael Jackson news in, I’ll give my reaction. Someone said the Murray hype must be hard to bear for British non-fans. True, no doubt, but it’s just as hard for the fans.
The reaction to Michael Jackson’s death is pretty hard to bear for those who, like me, can’t stand pop “music” and think 99.9% of it is worthless.
Back in the 1920s (within the lifetime of many still alive) there was no pop industry as such, but there were performers who sold lots of records, to which young people listened and danced. That music is now listened to and purchased only by specialist collectors and old folk who remember it. I gather “Huh” is one of the younger folk here. Well, Huh, when you have grandchildren, try asking them about Jackson – or Elvis or the Beatles – and they probably won’t know who you mean. Or if they do, they’ll dismiss them as boring old stuff.
If music is worth anything, surely it should last at least a lifetime.
The whole Jackson thing is made more extraordinary by the repulsively bizarre nature of the man himself – and I’m not alluding to the rumours about children. He may have had strong emotional reasons for being sick, but sick is what he was.

Von Says:

“There’s a roof. If it rains, it closes. Beyond that, we might as well guess what color socks someone is wearing.” Andy roddick.

There you go, there’s no other like Roddick! Roddick should run for public office after his tennis career is over. He has the capacity to take charge, confront and engage at all times, while exuding presence and high energy. He shows the willingness or appetite to be heard and seen, using voice projection. Most public speakers are groomed in this art of speaking, but with Andy, it’s innate. And is it any wonder why I love the guy? I’ve mentioned before, he brings a certain kind of electricity to the court. I love it! A few players try to emulate Roddick’s facileness, but they fall short.

I think I’d be correct in assuming Brad Gilbert is equally liked and despised — maybe 50-50, from some of the comments I see posted here. I happen to like him for his witty comebacks. I was watching a recording of Dr. Ivo (who’s a Gilbert fave in some respects) v. Tsonga, during which the commentators had a discussion on the Karlovic serve. Gilbert feels Karlovic is serving the best he’s seen him serve and feels he’ll be extremely tough to break at Wimby. There was a demonstration by shot spot on how high Karlovic’s serve bounces,(which is approx. 9-12 inches higher than the other servers) at which time Gilbert quipped that Olivier Rochus (who’s 5’5″ tall approx.) would need a to jump on a mini-trampoline to return those serves. I mean how precious was that quip. LOL. I love Gilbert for his spontaneous witticism — he’s a one-off, a natural, and hilarious person. LOL. Gilbert has deep admiration for huge servers, and I do too, because it’s a thing of beauty and an art form that’s innate for some servers, e.g., Karlovic and Roddick.

Tennis Freak Says:

As a freak, I worship creative sickness. I wonder how MJ’s music made you sick, as you didn’t sound like an ill person in the post above.
As for the universal globality, i.e. acceptable across all times and all generations of all cultures, there is no such thing. It is always field specific, and the old is duly respected by eclectic recycling by following generations within that field.
And as a musicphobe, you possess full right to express displeasure at media’s excessive coverage of a musician’s death, but the media is also working from within its parameters, respective marketability and profitability of these news materials.

To conclude, one man’s repulsion could be another man’s attraction.
Add this to the sweetness, this man’s music touched more people in the world than anyone’s ever in the history of music. We are mourning his passing because he could have given more (not he could have lived more “bizarrely”), had he lived longer.

Von Says:

I view Jackson more as a child in an adult body and one who’s never been allowed to progress through the stages of human development. His father and family pressures is what’s happened to Michael Jackson. We see this manifested in many adults who were forced to become adults during their childhood, and as a result they missed out on the critical stages of their development and maturity to complete their rites of passage.

Jackson’s ‘never-never land’ is symbolic of the child in the adult body who still yearned for his carefree child-like years and he probably used his ‘never-never-land’ as a means to escape the adult world and recapture his lost childhood. As he got older he regressed even more, and it seemed to become an obsession, hence the parties where he entertained hundreds of children. We’ve got to feel some sorrow for this guy who was so fixated on a stage of life that he was forced to forego, which resulted in him disallowing himself to become an adult and living as one. As Jackson got older, he regressed even more into his child-like stage whereby he grappled onto that youthful, soft, child-like voice, speaking in soft whispers, refusing to allow even the merest and/or detectable hint of the male adult timbre in his voice. It’s sad that a parent’s need for money and/or to become rich and famous can have such deleterious effects on its offspring.

Colin: I’m not a pop music person at heart,but I do try to embrace all forms of music, and have failed miserably, so I can identify with some of your musical dislikes. I did happen to like a few of MJ’s songs, the soft/mellow ones that is, and I found myself humming to a few bars of the lyrics to “I’ll be There” since the news of Jackson’s death was released. I think even a fuddy-duddy might probably find that song pleasant enough to listen to it and enjoy it — try it you might like it. LOL..

Von Says:

“…but the media is also working from within its parameters, respective marketability and profitability of these news materials.”

Well, the marketing world diddn’t miss a beat — they’ve quickly begun producing millions of MJ’s albums and they are being sold at record breaking, nightmarish and lightning like speed. I think there will be auctions, etc., you name it, it will happen, and his estate will be worth billions. It’s funny, the guy has not yet been buried and his family were going bonkers trying to find a current will. ‘Show me the money’, is being manifested to the hilt here. Maybe, I’ll even spring for the album that has “I’ll be there” in its list of songs. It’ll be my first! LOL.

Colin Says:

Where did I say Jackson’s stuff “made me sick”?
The sickness I referred to was that suffered by him as a person. Just look at his face!
And “Musicphobe”! That’s wonderful. Funny how I seem to have accumulated four and a half thousand records. Believe it or not, I even listen to them now and then.
You say no music is “acceptable across all times and all generations of all cultures”. Oh, but it is.
Of course there are some divisions, because Western and Eastern musics are based on completely different technical and formal systems. The fact that pop is enjoyed by oriental kids is due to the Westernisation of the world, which more or less means Americanisation. Nonetheless, there are plenty of oriental musicians who play western classical music, and at the highest level.
As for the time element, pop doesn’t, as I said before, last even in the culture that produces it.
Classical music does. The music in my record collection was composed as long ago as the 17th Century, and that music has survived the massive changes in taste and fashion, and successive entire genres. It’s survived well enough to make it worth manufacturing and marketing records of it.
As for the old being “duly respected by eclectic recycling”, yes, some composers do that, and pretty feeble some of the result is, but most composers would indignantly repudiate the notion. They try, not always with success of course, to be original. The recycling procedure is much more the norm in popular culture, usually to the detriment of the product. Popular dance music up to about World War II was watered-down jazz; rock ‘n’ roll is watered-down black rhythm and blues; soul is watered-down gospel.
Finally, don’t be hypnotised by numbers. Jackson’s stuff “touched more people in the world than anyone’s ever in the history of music”? No, it doesn’t work. Hitler wasn’t “worse” than the Spanish Inquisition,having killed more people. He had the advantage of modern weapons. Genghis Khan would have done as much damage as Stalin if he’d had the technology. Jackson sold a certain number of records, “touched” a certain number of people. That number is significant not as a number, but as a proportion of the world he lived in. He’ll be forgotten by the next century, and that number will remain pretty well static. Real music goes steadily on.
Oh, and I’m feeling optimistic about Andy Murray at Wimbledon.

Tennis Freak Says:

Would you use the same method as above to interpret women who have “male-ish” voice (e.g. Amy Winehouse, Cher, Tracy Chapman, Macy Gray, Katy Perry) or female hard rockers like Janis Joplin or Ann Wilson of Heart?

Von Says:


“Classical music does. The music in my record collection was composed as long ago as the 17th Century, and that music has survived the massive changes in taste and fashion, and successive entire genres. It’s survived well enough to make it worth manufacturing and marketing records of it.”

Ooohhh Colin, I’d love to see your collection. I hope you have ‘Handel’s Water Music’ and some muscial marches, that seem to rouse even the dead from their tombs. My kids say I listen to elevator music. ha ha.

Von Says:

TF: I didn’t use a ‘method’ per se. I don’t know of those artists’ backgrounds, so it would make it difficult for me to understand why the timbre in their voices is different from the norm. MJ’s voice to me spoke of his need to remain child-like, or apear that way, and it speaks volumes as to how much he wanted to recapture his lost childhood.

To be truthful, Cher is about the only one ot those mentioned with whom I’m familiar, and that says a lot about me and my musical tastes. Ask me about Tom Jones, (Mr. ‘It’s not unusual’) Englebert Humperdinck (the king of romance) and Barbra Streisand, and I’d be able to give you an educational response, but I’m lost with respect to most pop singers. Oh, I like Ronstadt.

Sorry, I couldn’t give you the answer you needed.

Colin Says:

While I was composing my screed in answer to Tennis Freak, I should have realised someone else might well be posting stuff!
Von, you do take on board the fact that Jackson was psychologically damaged. It’s sad when anyone dies at 50, and I’m sorry for someone who’s had their mind screwed up, but the “music” is another thing. I dislike pop music (and general pop culture), because it’s so damned inescapable, and above all because it’s CRAP. You may remember Sturgeon’s Law. When someone asked the SF author Theodore Sturgeon why 90% of science fiction is crap, he replied “90% of everything is crap”.
That’s where the longevity of classical music acts as a filter. Of course there are undeservedly forgotten composers, but by and large if the stuff is good, it survives.
Pop music, I always say, is the musical equivalent of tabloid journalism – slickly professional,ephemeral, superficial and facile. It puzzles me that intelligent people who’d be insulted if told they read only tabloids, are content with the equivalent in music.
I don’t try to like all types of music. I have a blind (or deaf)spot regarding Mahler, though I wouldn’t on that account claim he wasn’t great. Too many good judges think he was.
The most “popular” style of music I like is jazz, which may well be America’s greatest cultural gift to the world, though ironically it would never have evolved had it not been for slavery.

tenisbebe Says:

Von – he was actually in severe debt due to spending & legal fees. And those debts do not disappear with his death so the family probably needs to generate some cash quickly, while the iron is hot, so to speak. If there’s money left over for them, all the better.

But honestly, after all the reports about his suspected prescription drug abuse, is anyone really surprised by his early death? It’s tragic yes (for all the reasons Von started above) but not shocking. Remember Elvis and the 15,000 prescription drugs he was taking each month? I wonder how the tests will show MJ is taking but truthfully I just don’t care about these celebrities and their self-absorbed existence.

Classical music rocks!!

Colin Says:

I should like to say that this is about my favourite forum (not just on sport), because it’s possible for dicussions to start about wildly off-topic subjects, without being squashed.
Another thing I’d like to say (will this man never shut up?) is that I cannot read a note of music or play an instrument. That counters the frequent suggestion that classical music is elitist. If I can enjoy it in my ignorance, it can’t be!
Confession time – I have got some videos of Blondie in the group’s prime (and Debbie Harry’s prime), but that has nothing much to do with music!

Von Says:


“The most “popular” style of music I like is jazz, which may well be America’s greatest cultural gift to the world, though ironically it would never have evolved had it not been for slavery.”

There you go! I love jazz. There’s a place in Baltimore, or so I’ve been told, that has a huge focus on jazz, beside New Orleans, of course. MMT, I know you hail from there, perhaps you could you enlighten me on this. Thanks.

Now, back to you, Colin. I’m not into Jackson’s music and yes, there was a ton of psychological damage there, but what’s fascinating is the fact that he was able to channel his problems into his music, embodying the child, and some risque adult thinking. That shows someone bordering on the edge of effectiveness in his attempt to bridge the gap between childhood and adulthood, but not quite getting there.

Tennis Freak Says:

Not many pay attention to Beethoven, Mozart, or Bach within another genre, say Rap. Your music and my music are different genres unless you are speaking in tautology (whatever survives is classic; instead of classic survives all times). Your music is dead for me. I like classic Rock, but that’s not what you seem to mean by “classic.”
To me, classic is a genre within music and whatever you are calling “classic” survives within that genre, not outside, not for me and many others. And we can ALSO (stress that word) speak of “classics” when some pieces acquire frequent referential, landmark, status within a genre, thus genre specific classics. For instance, Manu Dibango’s Soul Makossa (1972) is considered as disco classic. How is that universal? And sometimes, recycling has produced better music (Ref. Roland Barthes’ “Image, Music, Text”).
I wish I could carry this conversation forever if we were in music forum. So I resign.

Von Says:

TF: “Not many pay attention to Beethoven, Mozart, or Bach within another genre, say Rap.”

I’m sorry to disagree, but you are so wrong. classical music, or to be more specific, the classical composers’ music is timeless, where it has been able to bridge the gap between eras and peoples from every walk of life, (language and socio-economic status), and has remained time-tested and/or battle-tested. College students are introduced to this type of music and many have been able to appreciate it despite the music of their era. Thus, I would say, this is what is meant by ‘classical’ music — one that has acclaimed significance despite language, socio-economic, and/or race barriers.

Tennis Freak Says:

You can disagree, but I can say the same, “you are so wrong.” I disagree with your disagreement unless you give me Rap’s musical reference (improvement or distortion) to Beethoven’s, say 9th Symphony, or for that matter, Friedrich Schiller’s Ode to Joy”? Or, how does Frank Sinatra contribute to Smashing Pumpkins? Just give me evidence, examples. Just because you like one kind of music does not give you the right to call other types of music “crap,” depthless, superficial, lifeless, and terminal.
Look at the history of music: They opposed Rock n Roll and Jazz the same way you are resisting pop music (a broad genre, within which we have at least 50 recognizable sub-genres). In the early ’80s, the mainstream music critics demonized Rap. It was a difficult journey to the mainstream.
This is a political terrain already: You are in favor of monopoly of a few and select; and I am in the favor of all, democratizing music. There is no master race to call others sub-humans; and there is no super music called “classics” holding the sole right to be the “only lasting music.” This is a fight that takes place within the academy all the time, between the old and young. The young are winning the fight as we get to study Jimmy Hendrix, 2-Pac, and all, and the so-called classics are just one among many choices.

jane Says:

Colin says, ” it’s possible for dicussions to start about wildly off-topic subjects, without being squashed.”

Yes, I agree – we should be able to digress. Especially on the middle Sunday of Wimbledon.

My 8 yr. old son recently began piano lessons, and he’s had to learn facts about various composers and listen to and play some of their music, some of which he recognizes from Bugs Bunny cartoons (you know, the Mozart, the Bach…)! He likes it.

But far be it for me to limit music in my house – we like pretty much every kind of music round here – punk (yep, even the Queen’s jubilee villains), rock (classic, alternative, indie, some pop, though this is the least fave), country (mostly old stuff), jazz, reggae, hindi (Bollywood rocks!), classical, show-tunes, folk, melodramatic songstresses a la Piaf, etc, etc.

Anyway – very interesting reading all of your posts on MJ and music.

Von Says:


Feel free to disagree with me, I don’t have a problem with anyone’s disagreement of my opinions, all ask is they do so with civility. However, I do have a problem with the following:

“Just because you like one kind of music does not give you the right to call other types of music “crap,” depthless, superficial, lifeless, and terminal.”

Excuse me, when did I ever say that? Please show me where. Those are your words and your meaning of what I mentioned. This is where a discussion with you needs to end. I’m sorry you need to read again, and again. Before I stop, I can apply your umbrage to my supposed remarks, by saying you emphatically called all the athletes on the men’s tour, save two, Federer and Nadal, ‘spineless, etc., etc., leeches’. I hope you see how those broad implications can work on the other side of the spectrum. From my coign of vantage, when one embarks upon a stance, then he/she needs to apply that analogy to everything, and there isn’t a middle ground. And, I hope you now understand how this type of generalizing can raise people’s ire. I’m sorry but I’m not going to try to befriend you by overlooking your negative assertions, you’ll only get honesty from me, and it’s up to you to determine if you like or dislike my stance or points of view. And, I don’t see you as a challenge for me at all, thereby tring to coddle you, hoping you’ll turn around, see things my way, and establsh a friendly rapport. Anyway, thank you for your time.

jane Says:

Tennis Freak have you heard of Baba Brinkman? He raps Chaucer’s “Canterbury Tales” as he found the same cadences in medieval poetry as modern hip hop. Also, there are some great Algerian rap artists.

And even though my son likes classical music, his favorite music is by Green Day. LOL.

Tennis Freak Says:

You pretty much agreed with Colin.
Turn around where? Be your convert and see immortality of music is exclusive to one genre, just like humanity is exclusive to the Empire? Sorry, that’s not what I was taught at school.

About my calling “spineless,” I was only daring them, with good intention. I want everyone one of them to see as good as Fed or better (read my follow-ups in my conversation with Jane). That was the gist, and I accept I did not do so well in a nice language because there was a sub-goal to draw attention and provoke (like you were somewhere talking about children and love).

Even if Chaucer is not a classical musician, Brinkman’s recycling or producing pastiche out of Chaucer or medieval poetry is similar what everyone does, but with an “anxiety of influence,” rebelling against the parents, thus the birth of genres. What if everyone everywhere followed Bach in every which way?
Green Day is my type of classics. Works for me.

tenisbebe Says:

OK – since we have deviated so far from tennis – my favorite “rock” cd/album (and as TF said this embraces multiple genre): U2 Joshua Tree. Hands down.

jane Says:

tenisbebe, I saw U2 on their tour for Joshua Tree; next weekend I am going to Green Day. Nothing better than live music. And just to throw a Canadian band’s name out there – The Arcade Fire. Wow.

Tennis Freak Says:

Were you a hippie groupie in your teenage days? , Sorry if you are offended by this question.

Yeah, t-bebe, I like that album.

jane Says:

Tennis Freak, “hippee groupie”? Nah. Just an ardent music fan, all of my life actually. In my teenage years I was closer to a new waver than a hippee. I am not that old! : )

I go to live shows for the experience of hearing the music performed, interpreted, and loose. I listen to the symphony live too, so it is something about live music per se. Not about the bands, which I assume the groupie life is all about.

Von Says:

Tennis Freak:

I’m sorry to disappoint you, I didn’t one hundred percent agree with Colin on his musical choices. I agreed with him on what’s generally known as ‘Classical” music, the famous composers, et al. I do like some pop and other forms of music. I happen to like, even though they are before my generation, rhythm and blues, doo wop, Nat King Cole, Frank Sinatra, and i even like Dirk Bogarde talking to music (if you’ve ever heard that one). But yes, I do have an open mind and I try to embrace all types of music and the artists’ expressions to their music.

“Be your convert and see immortality of music is exclusive to one genre, just like humanity is exclusive to the Empire? Sorry, that’s not what I was taught at school.”

I think you need to read again, I don’t want you to be my convert. I could care less what you think of me. As I said, I’m not going to coddle you in an effort to elicit a blog friendship and/or to increase my popularity here. Sorry, I’m perfectly able to stand on my own without your support. You see, TF, i’m comfortable with who and what I am, and as such I don’t need validation. And, whether you agree with me on this or not, this is my take, on learning: Our personalities and/or thinking should not be moulded by our teachers, but first by our parents. As a child sees, he does. Teachers are our guides to a higher learning, but our parents are the ones responsible for our character building.

BTW, I happen to like Chaucer’s more or less ‘extant’ vernacular.

Tennis Freak Says:

I did not mean 70s by “hippie.”
Several of my friends who do not miss concerts of certain hard rock bands have that modified hippie look: long hair, beard, hemp jewelery, body piercings, African, Caribbean, Indian outfits, and cannabis. That’s what I was thinking of when I used the term “hippie groupie.”
Sorry !

jane Says:

OH yuck – am so not that type Tennis Freak; I can smell the patchouli oil from here. No, as I say, “new wave” – more Blondie in style, or even mod-classic, like Style Council. Not hippee. No no no.

tenisbebe Says:

C’mon Jane, you’re not sportin’ a beard? No piercings? Tee hee.

I also love live music, it’s the best! Didn’t see the Joshua Tree tour but was at the “Unforgettable Fire” concert at Red Rocks….sigh. Those college days.. Am seeing Widespread Panic and Black Crowes in a few weeks.

Will have to check out The Arcade Fire.

Von – do you like Chris Isaak? Love that man’s music.

Tennis Freak Says:

I appreciate your stance of “embracing all kinds of music.” All I am saying is your embrace of diversity should extend to the criteria of immortality as well. Immortality of music should not be reserved for one genre. That does not mean all works of music within all genres survive timelessly: It means each genre has its own criteria to decide the life span of a work in its way, and those criteria are evolutionary, and some of the supposedly dead works are sometimes brought back to life later in new forms.

tenisbebe Says:

Jane – I am impressed that you could spell “patchouli” still.

jane Says:

Oh you were at Red Rocks? Lucky you tenisbebe! Both of Arcade Fire’s albums are interesting: some songs on “Funeral” (their first) have been called Bowie-like and some on their second record have been likened to Springsteen. So their influences are wide. But they are particularly interesting live as they have about 10 players on stage, including accordians, violins, all types of percussion, strings. Very lively and musical. The two singers and songwriters are a husband and wife from Montreal. Do check them out.

jane Says:

tenisbebe, “I am impressed that you could spell “patchouli” ” – I had to look it up. lol.

Von Says:

tenisbebe: You mean ‘baby did a Bad, bad thing’? Yes, I can handle that. lol. He’s a very handsome guy, rugged good looks, etc., etc., etc., Ha ha. I’m very reserved in almost everything, so now you know, but I’m young enough to appreciate the new wave of music too. I like Shania Twain for instance. I’m not into modern day band music, but I do like the older bands. I think some of the new bands are noisy and I don’t like noise. Keeping things quiet is my MO. Lol. I suppose you could call me boring, but what the heck, so I’m boring. lol. There I’ve said it.

TF: But isn’t that what I’m saying some music can live on throughout the ages? Classical’ music has been revamped, but it has a foundation. There is light classical and then the real McCoy, but all in all, the foundation is there, and it also ties in with your thoughts on: ” It means each genre has its own criteria to decide the life span of a work in its way, and those criteria are evolutionary, and some of the supposedly dead works are sometimes brought back to life later in new forms.” This is where I feel classical music has proved its tried and true mettle and has survived the generations.

Anyway, I think we’ve hit an impasse, stale mate, check mate, etc., so how about if we agree to disagree and move on, eh? Thanks.

tenisbebe Says:

Does this mean Sister Von sheds her habit for musicians? Tsk, tsk. Yes he is a handsome lad, and that voice! Oh la la…

Von Says:

tenisbebe: Yeah, sister Von would shed her habit for some musicians, hasn’t happened yet, but there’s still life in these ‘old’ bones, and anything’s a possibiity with life. That voice and face are enough to charm the the pantaloons off of the sisters. LOL.

margot Says:

TD(Tam) : even Murray fans HATE the hype. I aviod it by only listening to Pat Cash and turning off the sound when any gushing starts. I only read one newspaper and it’s not the idolising type. It’s embarrassing, believe me.
re music: Greensleaves does it for me, is it a “pop” song?
re mj: so talented, so damaged, so sad.
a wimbles wish- please Verdasco take out K. please.
for all you Americans: article in USA Today about Andy M saying how much he loves yer and USOpen. Well, I just love him, to say that in the middle of Wimbles is just brilliant!

huh Says:

I’ve gotta say I’m a Chinese and don’t know too much about European classical music except that classical and folk music exceed all other types of music in appeal. But there’re also some songs in pop and every other type, which’re nothing but classics.

huh Says:

I’m a music lover, and lover in the sense that I forget myself whenever I’m into music. And if you’re a music lover in the true sense of the term, you’d appreciate and love all types of music and of course’d love some more than the others. So cool !

huh Says:

Have you ever, while alone, ever heard a shepherd playing upon
his flute while takin out his herds for grazing? I bet you’d love it, your soul would be liberated, peace and emotions’d take over. You’d become nostalgic, tears of satisfaction may follow !

Skorocel Says:

tenisbebe: Black Crowes? Are they still playing? I though they were long “defunct” by now… I have to admit, I don’t know that much about them (well, virtually nothing), but I clearly remember their videoclip for the “Remedy” song (which they shot back in 1992 or 1991)… I was only 10 at that time, and I could see it at least 5 times a day on the MTV channel:-)

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